X-Post - Interest in DIY chip tuning?
12-13-2009, 07:30 PM
#48
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as said before +1 for Supercharger at 5PSI Boost!
The Stock DME can handle that small amount, an IC would not theoretically be need to start with although helpful, The NA's internals can handle it.
The way i figure it, youll get around 30hp at 5 Boost and a chip could really help with the smoothness!
The Stock DME can handle that small amount, an IC would not theoretically be need to start with although helpful, The NA's internals can handle it.
The way i figure it, youll get around 30hp at 5 Boost and a chip could really help with the smoothness!
Frankly, I would get the M90 from a Ford Thunderbird, as it is a simple 4-bolt pattern inlet/outlet design, and cheap to find on Ebay. Couple that with a stock 951 IC (50-75$), and you could have an inexpensive setup for relatively little...
The main thing would be to do the brackets and setup - would be nice if someone would do a setup, then standardize the necessary ancillaries and sell them as a DIY kit.
I'm working on a knock computer setup for the NA guys - just not sure how much demand there would be... So frankly, I have not put much time into it.
i cant see any chip companies being able to "retune" a chip for this type of change as it has SOOO many variables. self tuning is the only way to go!
EDIT: as if its not long enough...
A Custom Chip would be REQUIRED to setup a car to run E85 or other alternative Fuels! E85 is FAR more forgiving, especially with boost! you can boost MUCH further easier with it!
EDIT: as if its not long enough...
A Custom Chip would be REQUIRED to setup a car to run E85 or other alternative Fuels! E85 is FAR more forgiving, especially with boost! you can boost MUCH further easier with it!
-Rogue
12-13-2009, 08:01 PM
#49
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12-13-2009, 08:15 PM
#50
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Frankly, I would get the M90 from a Ford Thunderbird, as it is a simple 4-bolt pattern inlet/outlet design, and cheap to find on Ebay. Couple that with a stock 951 IC (50-75$), and you could have an inexpensive setup for relatively little...
The main thing would be to do the brackets and setup - would be nice if someone would do a setup, then standardize the necessary ancillaries and sell them as a DIY kit.
The main thing would be to do the brackets and setup - would be nice if someone would do a setup, then standardize the necessary ancillaries and sell them as a DIY kit.
12-13-2009, 10:35 PM
#51
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12-14-2009, 03:57 AM
#52
lol....don't worry V2 no ones going to steal your mojo!
but when you get it sorted out let me in on the secrets!
i don't know about that high boost...then again the E85 adds a totally new twist to it combustion and pressure. as i always said 200RWHP and close to that in Torque is the sweet spot for the car and would be the perfect match to the handling!
wondering how much larger injectors are needed for the 5-8 Pounds of boost....
EDIT: after research and looking at Eatons Site, i have come see that the m60, both 3rd and 4th generation are a better fit to out cars than the m90, the size is smaller! it only robs 11hp at 6k RPM to run the Supercharger vs the 15HP at 6k to run the m90. those stats are for 10PSI also.
also SOME of the Eaton M60 has an electric clutch built in that can be used by button to turn on/off. or by the normal bypass valve. the M90 has no such option! to me this is a HUGE loss!
One thing the M90 does have though is the cost! it is slightly cheaper although with it being bigger, what are you really saving after buying/machining the snout down....
the M90 does force more air per engine revolution and cycle BUT that raised the PSI, this could potentially make the Tuning and getting the perfffffect amount of PSI tuff. starting with a smaller platform you are more able to go up and down in smaller increments!
but when you get it sorted out let me in on the secrets!
i don't know about that high boost...then again the E85 adds a totally new twist to it combustion and pressure. as i always said 200RWHP and close to that in Torque is the sweet spot for the car and would be the perfect match to the handling!
wondering how much larger injectors are needed for the 5-8 Pounds of boost....
EDIT: after research and looking at Eatons Site, i have come see that the m60, both 3rd and 4th generation are a better fit to out cars than the m90, the size is smaller! it only robs 11hp at 6k RPM to run the Supercharger vs the 15HP at 6k to run the m90. those stats are for 10PSI also.
also SOME of the Eaton M60 has an electric clutch built in that can be used by button to turn on/off. or by the normal bypass valve. the M90 has no such option! to me this is a HUGE loss!
One thing the M90 does have though is the cost! it is slightly cheaper although with it being bigger, what are you really saving after buying/machining the snout down....
the M90 does force more air per engine revolution and cycle BUT that raised the PSI, this could potentially make the Tuning and getting the perfffffect amount of PSI tuff. starting with a smaller platform you are more able to go up and down in smaller increments!
Last edited by phil823; 12-14-2009 at 11:48 AM.
12-14-2009, 01:16 PM
#53
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the M90 has a vacuum bypass valve so that it only actually compresses air under WOT or near WOT. when just coasting it uses almost no power to drive the thing as no work is being done by it, you just have hung 5lbs of aluminum rotors on the drive belt at 1.5x crank speed.
something to keep in mind is that 10psi at 6000rpm on the m90 and 10psi at 6000rpm on the M62 are very different. the m90, being larger, turns slower than the m62 to achieve the same boost, which makes it more volumetrically efficient and doesnt heat the air as much. the downside to roots blowers is that they make ALOT of heat. the M90 was made for "3.0 to 5.7L passenger cars" but i really think it will work just fine on the thumping great 2.5L 4 banger.
something to keep in mind is that 10psi at 6000rpm on the m90 and 10psi at 6000rpm on the M62 are very different. the m90, being larger, turns slower than the m62 to achieve the same boost, which makes it more volumetrically efficient and doesnt heat the air as much. the downside to roots blowers is that they make ALOT of heat. the M90 was made for "3.0 to 5.7L passenger cars" but i really think it will work just fine on the thumping great 2.5L 4 banger.
12-14-2009, 04:45 PM
#54
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the M90 has a vacuum bypass valve so that it only actually compresses air under WOT or near WOT. when just coasting it uses almost no power to drive the thing as no work is being done by it, you just have hung 5lbs of aluminum rotors on the drive belt at 1.5x crank speed.
-Rogue
12-14-2009, 05:06 PM
#55
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the valve on my m90 is very arcane, it is pretty much on/off. i even held the valve next to my 944 while it was running and hooked the valve up to the throttle body and blipped it a few times and the valve opened. however on slower progressive throttling it remained closed. the one i am using is the 3rd generation eatons, the newer m62 gm's (cobalt ss/ion redline) are 5th generation which allows alot of time for development.
12-14-2009, 05:35 PM
#56
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the valve on my m90 is very arcane, it is pretty much on/off. i even held the valve next to my 944 while it was running and hooked the valve up to the throttle body and blipped it a few times and the valve opened. however on slower progressive throttling it remained closed. the one i am using is the 3rd generation eatons, the newer m62 gm's (cobalt ss/ion redline) are 5th generation which allows alot of time for development.
I bet you will be quite surprised about the boost response of your Eaton w/ the bypass valve. I'll bet it will be very linear with your throttle, as I mentioned earlier.
-Rogue
12-14-2009, 09:14 PM
#59
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yea ive looked at those but they are mega expensive. i like the clutched idea. however youd have to program something in for it. on the kompressor the supercharger is used primarily at lower speeds to get the car off the line smoothly. as the engine speed picks up and the 4 cylinder gets into its power range the sc shuts off.