Vonov

I'll have an update in a day or so...for those who will attempt making their own plate, keep in mind that the two uppermost holes in the VR6 bellhousing are NOT in a perfect vertical line perpendicular with the head and block; there's approximately a 10-15 degree difference. which will throw you off slightly if you assume that the "top" of the bell will line up parallel with the top edge of the TT plate.

Hmmmm...a simpler way to put it would be, if the block and head are at the twelve o clock position, if one were looking at the clock from the TT toward the front of the car, that what appears to be the the "top" edge of the bellhousing, is actually oriented toward approximately the eleven o clock position.

WRC_413X

Just got back from the big VW show waterfest, and im itching for the VR6
updates?

WRC_413X

Have you been working on the project recently? share some update pictures

Vonov

Patience, Grasshopper...work has been interfering when the weather hasn't. When my sergeant calls and says, "Boots and saddles," I have to drop what I'm doing and ride, and I have to get sleep sometime, in addition to getting all the reports done, interviewing victims, identifying burnt cars, etc. Oh, yes, and there's a little four year old beauty who also makes demands on my time, lol..."Fix this, Daddy..."hug, Daddy?"...and of course, the old favorite (from the bathroom), "Daddddddyyyyyy...come heeeeerre..." with a little giggle (she knows some things gag me) indicating I have a hygiene chore to attend to...(phew!!)

I promise one and all I will finish this project...my target is to have the car ready for next year's Southern Worthersee event in May, in Helen, GA...

WRC_413X

Understood, i definitely know where your coming from, im just eager to do mine, the weather has definitely been sucking hard here too.

WRC_413X

how were the splines going to work on this? do they match up?
also what clutch setup will you be running?

Vonov

The clutch disc will likely be a custom clutch, with 944 splines on a VW-style hub, although somewhere I read that the VW VR6 splines are the same size and configuration as those on the 944, which I would not find all that surprising, since the 944 uses what was basically an Audi FWD trans, split from the bellhousing and moved to the rear, and using the TT to connect bellhousing and trans.

In the meantime, I've been removing the dash, etc, to gain access to the firewall and top of the bellhousing, to determine how best to modify the trans tunnel, and what, if anything, may need to be done regarding the controls for the heater, etc...

My funding for the project got pushed back about 500 bucks when I accidentally backed into someone else's car though.

MM951

FWIW, the 944 clutch disk splines are different then a VR6. At least I could not use my 944 clutch alignment tool with my VR6 clutch.

bullmoose

The 944 with the 7A 20v engine is mine. I have no idea what the clutchplate diameter is on the VR6 but I know the Audi 2.8 V6 plate fits the 944 splines. So does a Ford Transit (van) plate....thats what I'm using...

Cheers!

Vonov

Thank you, bullmoose...I've been an admirer of your project for some time now...

I'm dealing with a lot of frustration right now; between my caseload, court dates, weather, the honeydew list, and home maintenance issues, I haven't been getting a hell of a lot done on my project. Hopefully some of that will change when the little darlings stealing cars in West Nashville go back to school (curfew laws during school year make it easier to keep a damper on things) and things slow down a bit. (Somehow, it's hard to call it joyriding when the little SOB's decide for fun to roll the car down the boat ramp when they're done with it.)

Vonov

Finally...had time to work on the 944 this weekend...Grandaddy's in town, which means my little one is monopolizing HIS time (not that he objects, lol) and freeing me for other things; even the weather is cooperating---gotta love a sub-80 degree day in Nashville during the month of August! Got the heater box/core out, and it appears modification of that component should be fairly easy, simplifying the mod necessary to the bellhousing/TT tunnel; I *may* lose floor heat, but I rarely use it anyway, and proper insulation of the floor panels should make it unnecessary unless I move to Alaska, and (tongue firmly in cheek here) Sarah Palin's already married, lol...

EDIT: Meant to ask...those of you who've had your heater box/core out...are they always so FILTHY?? Mine was seriously nasty...took me a half hour with Bleche-Wite, a brush, and a garden hose to make it something I'd put back in the car...

Vonov

A relevant question was asked by a poster on another forum; I'm posting it here for those who are interested in doing this swap:


Quote:
Originally Posted by reclaimer
I was looking at a Jetta last week, it was a 97 with the AAA. It looked like the starter was in about the nine or ten o'clock position when viewed from what would be the rear in a rwd setup. The slave cylinder was near the one o'clock spot.
Then I looked at an early 944. The tunnel area near the throttle pedal angled away from the pedal, so there's room to be had there for the starter.
I also understand pulling the climate control assembly to make working room. I realize the slave cylinder looks as if it's going to cause the most problem as far as actual sheet metal work at this point.
But something else caught my eye as being a potential problem. I think it might be wise at this point to consider trying to borrow the rear timing chain cover and the coolant pipes/housings that bolt on the rear of the engine.
After looking at numerous pictures of other rwd vr6 setups, I noticed all of the ones that I could see had simply made u turns at the inlet and outlet pipes with hose and then made the run back to the front with pipe.
Should you need additional room at the rear of the engine to make these same u turns, now would be a good time to make that room with the climate control removed.
Depending on how much more the engine needs to be moved rearward to mate properly with the center shaft, and your options with the coolant pipes... Simply cutting one hole for the starter and then another for the slave cylinder may not be enough.

I look forward to your findings. I've been looking at engines other than the GM unit myself. I also want to keep it in the family so to speak. I'm not a fan of the 2.5 lump, and while the vr6 may not be the best thing sense sliced bread, I think it would be a good engine for the 944.
My only reservation is the amount of firewall modification that might be required depending on engine final placement.
Please post more pictures as you solve the coolant pipe issues.

(Vonov)
I've already noticed the issue you've mentioned, and I'm planning to have a 90-degree aluminum block machined to handle that issue; the fitting you're speaking of is sort of like a junction box for the cooling system---there is nothing critical at that point regarding the engine, which cannot be routed differently. Since the back of the cam cover actually extends slightly rearward of the block itself, we can utilize the clearance that affords to make that possible. The thermostat housing will likely be incorporated into the aluminum block I'm having fabricated (nice to have friends who are machinists!), or it can be moved elsewhere, according to my VW guru. At any rate, the idea is to have the coolant outlets the stock fitting provides coming out the side of the engine. I will, of course, post pics when that is done; my idea in doing this build is to hopefully blaze a trail for others to follow and maybe improve upon. Someday, I'd like to see this swap become as common as the LSx swaps are now.

Vonov

Okay, finally have pics from trans tunnel modification. I used a knockoff version of a tool similar to the Fein Multimaster...the blades used with the knockoff are inferior to those for the Fein, as they're a bit soft, but the control the tool affords when cutting metal is amazing...For those doing this, I recommend using a step drill to make a good-sized hole for the blade to bite into. The tool WILL make plunge cuts, but the blades last longer if you have an edge to bite into...also, LIGHT pressure is the best way to go, you MUST let the speed of the tool do the work.

First pic is from the engine bay...slave cylinder for the clutch has loads of clearance.

Second one is taken from right next to the driveline tunnel; the intrusion into the footwell is minimal.
The red plastic piece is the throttle pedal mounting base.

Third one is taken from about where the driver's seat normally is...modification to the heater box and A/C will be unnecessary, even with the starter elevated to the operational position (approx 1/2 inch above and slightly to the right of where it is in the photos. I will use some emery cloth to smooth the edges, prime, seal, and cover the opening. I've not decided whether to make the new panel which will cover the starter removable or not.

pontifex4

Tony,

That looks like hard work! It's hard to tell from the photos, but how much will this impact the clearance the side of your right foot has in this orientation?

Vonov

Actually, very little. Most of the intrusion into the passenger compartment takes place further back, where the driveline tunnel narrows...