Yummybud924

weird looking online the 928s seem cheaper than the 951s, well the pre S4

I'm just parnoid about timing belts. 951 I can just change the belt myself within a day as I have the tools. 928 I'll have to learn how to do it and it looks like a bitch with the 7 feet long belt.

plus it's much easier to replace a head on a 944 if the belt does go, than on a 928.

that's why I said 16 valve 928. Plus a lot of the early 78-80 928s are 5speed which is a plus. but the early 928s are kind of ugly with the pone dials and no spoiler .

Erzengal

928 parts are right next to 993's for high prices, and in some cases, even more. A 928 is great if you can source the parts you need used in good condition and can maintain the car yourself. Otherwise its one of the most expensive Porsches to own over time.

928's are great cars if you can find a reliable, well maintained one, however do keep in mind what it may need in the future. The adage "There is no such thing as a cheap Porsche" is very true. Many of the cheap, low priced Porsches are rarely a good buy, due to lack of proper maintainace and abuse.

Both 951 and 928 are similar in maintaince costs, both have thier quirks. Its those unexpected repairs and failures that will bite you.

Yummybud924

well if maintenance costs are the same, I'd prefer a 928 over a 951 just because I like the sound of a v8.

I'm guessing parts are also harder to get for 928. Even for the 944 sometimes I've had to wait a week or two to come in.

well even prices on the 944 are pretty high when you compare them to car parts for domestic or japanese cars. 300 dollar water pumps, 40 dollar caps, 150 dollar wire sets etc.

think the spark plug wire set for a 928 is lik 300 bucks or so.

I think I'd prefer a 951 for maintenace because I have to do most of the repairs myhself to afford it and I already have bought lots of 944 specific tools, like the crank lock, timing belt wrench, various sockets, tanny plug allen tool etc. plus I"ve worked on my 944 so much it's not so scary to work on it anymore

928s i don't know anything about. I heard there is a Bently 928 manual but think they are rare.

V2Rocket

could do the LSx swap...V8 power and reliability until judgment day


and here come the super purists...

docmirror

That would be incorrect.

Legoland951

The 928 used parts are more scarce but I have owned many 928s and 951s in the past. I can say positively given the same level of maintenance, the 928 is hands down more reliable. I have never been left stranded in a 928. There are more interior electrical issues such as window switches and dash cluster anomalies but the drivetrain is pretty much bullet proof. My friend from college owned his for 19 years and the only drivetrain replacement part was the clutch and DME solder joint. He drives his car hard and has a 5 speed.

My 951s in the past had blown head gasket (probably due to age and higher compression under boost), bad DME relay causing no start, rubber fuel line leaking almost caught on fire, and the small spring in the clutch center break causing the clutch not to disengage since its caught between the pressure plate and flywheel. These are driveline reliability problems I have experienced having logged more than 100k miles on both a 928 and a 951.

Yummybud924

interesting. yeah I would think a boosted motor will have more reliability problems with the added stress and heat etc.

only thing with the 928 is that the newer ones if the belt breaks then you are screwed. used 928 engines go for 4k plus.

I think only the 78-82 928s are non interference but not sure about that. doesn't the 928S still have a 16 valve motor?

I like the look of the 928 . the really early 928s are not too pretty. Also not sure if I'd like an automatic sportscar, might feel like i'm driving a v8 cadillac.

Legoland951

The 951/944s are all interference engines with timing belt issues also. With the same level of maintenance, that is equal between the 2 cars with the 928 having an advantage as some are non interference. 928S from 84+ I believe have the 32 valve engines. The 86.5 has the S4 brakes, which is the same as the turbo S 4 piston caipers and the GT/S has the equivalent of the big reds stock. The 928 is a much more substantial car and solid. It also was the most expensive Porsche made for many years costing more than a 911 turbo in some trims at over 100k more than 10 years ago.

KLR

I don't agree with this. If I look back at the maintenance records for my 951 back to 1996 (60k miles), the vast majority of the expenditure would be identical for a 944 S2 or even a 944 N/A. The big $ items have been a steering rack, A/C, control arms, brake work, replacement of worn suspension items (shocks/struts, bushings, and a tie rod end), tires, etc. Although I don't have the pre 60k mile records, judging from the minimal work required between 60k and 80k, I doubt if anything more than basic maintenance was required.

951 specific expenses over the past 12 years were extra time for a clutch (a few hundred $), an electric turbo water pump ($180), and I suppose a little bit of extra time for a recent rod bearing job. I'm still on my original turbo at 137k miles. Even if I had to have it rebuilt tomorrow, it wouldn't cost more than $1k if I farm it out to a shop. I've also replaced my headers and wastegate, but neither expenditure was required -- the car boosted to 12psi just fine with a tired original wastegate and to 14psi with a slightly leaky #2 runner on the headers.

This is far from double the costs for a non-turbo 944 over 20 years. If you don't heavily mod 951s, they are not really much more maintenance intensive than other 944s. The number of jobs that require significant extra time (i.e., clutch or rod bearings) should be once every 10-20 year jobs.

I would also agree with the post above that there is very good support for 928s. Just take a look at the post count in the 928 forum here on Rennlist.

Legoland951

I think the original post is about reliability and not maintenance items which I interpret given the same level of maintenance, which one is more likely to leave you on the road.

KLR

Given equal and fastidious maintenance, I don't think that either car is likely to ever leave you stranded. Differentiating between the two given that this should be a rare occurence with both would be pretty tough. Here's an old survey with some numbers on 944 strandings --> https://rennlist.com/forums/showthre...leave+stranded

If you read through the posts, most look preventable and none look like serial issues.

xsboost90

"Asking about 928 maintanance in a non-928 area is sure to bring false comments by ignorant people who have never owned one. Why not ask on the 928 board? You'll get some honest advice, it wont be all cheerleading."

wow i hadnt seen any cheerleading up to this post. He asked about a comparison- i think there would be just as much cheerleading on that side as well..

one person says that maintenance on a 951 is expensive- then says that if you wrench on your own 928 they arent bad. Now i cant say one way or another which is most reliable just what ive heard of the electrical gremlins of the 928. Ive not had problems w/ my 951 or 944 as i keep maintenance up on them and wrench on it myself so it doesnt seem so expensive to me. I think any porsche that is constantly maintained by a shop would be expensive.

Legoland951

I don't remember ever seeing a 928 with a blown head gasket even if its 20 years old (that had coolant in it). It does not spontaneously catch on fire (latest victim Porsche O Phile where his car burnt to a crisp - I have seen 2 951s burn in front of my face twice other than Jeff's) with that fuel line and it has happened to a few people on this board. Just do a search. Maybe due to the engine bay temperature, I have never heard of a DME relay or crank/reference sensor failure in a 928. I am not sure if its the same part as I never had to deal with a 928 no start problem. The belt on the early 928 is simple as I have done it before. Please chime in if you have actual experience as misinformation will lead someone down the wrong road.

xsboost90

i gave no mis-information just stated my experience. Do not take my positive experience w/ MY car as a bash towards a 928. Ive also never had any of these problems w/ my car because i keep up on my maintenance and recalls.

Legoland951

Dan, I wasn't refering to you so sorry if it sounded like it. Its refering to future posts for others to chime in.