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Well, I just got the 30 days warning to my first "official" oil change (I did a post break-in change at 3000km using LM), so I guess that I better confirm with the dealer that they have M1 C40 on hand for this appointment or I will be putting in the order for more LM over the internet...
I continue to be amazed at how casual most dealerships and PCNA are regarding use of A40 oil instead of C40. I changed my oil yesterday using Liqui Moly C40.
I continue to be amazed at how casual most dealerships and PCNA are regarding use of A40 oil instead of C40. I changed my oil yesterday using Liqui Moly C40.
The car manufacturer's oil specifications present a performance standard which must be achieved through a large series of destructive bench tests for example cam wear, cam pitting, sludge tests, piston cleanliness etc. They do not specify the additive pack other than a minimum TBN - it's up to the oil company / blender to work with its additive pack provider to formulate an oil to meet the requirements and pay fairly hefty sums to put it through the tests required to support their application for manufacturer approval - well into the hundreds of thousands of €/$/£.
Following from Bill's post above, I would tentatively agree that if you sent two used oil samples, one C40 and one A40, back to the oil manufacturer, then they could devise a method to determine which was which based on tests for certain additives. However, the complication is different oil companies use different additive providers - Exxon might use Infineum, others may use Lubrizol. So if an independent lab is trying to determine if an oil is C40 compliant without knowing what they are looking for, the chances of making a definitive conclusion are very low IMO.
If you go to the Lubrizol relative performance tool, you can see that C40 has a higher performance standard for the soot thickening, sludge and piston deposit tests than A40. Hopefully VW 511 00 will make its way into the Afton Specification Handbook next revision and the details of the tests (VW 511 = C40) will be more readily accessible.
With all the discussion I keep coming back to this chart published by Lubrizol, it sums up pretty well the difference between the A40 and C40 specs on oil for our Porsches. I just ordered two more 5 liter jugs of LM top tec 4110 from FCPEuro, should last me into next year at my current rate of driving. Not only is the C40 better at reducing soot, deposits and sludge but also slightly better for fuel economy and significantly better for "aftertreatment compatibility" whatever that means. Thanks again for publishing this.
Yes, the only reason to run the C40 in a normally aspirated engine would be to protect the particulate filter (if equipped). As the Euro 6 standard requires a GFP on all cars in Europe, the C40 oil would meet the ACEA C2/C3 specifications for sulfated ash to protect them. The main reason to run a C40 over the A40 oil is for turbocharged engines as an A40 oil does not provide protection for LSPI due to high calcium detergent levels which must be much lower to prevent LSPI.
Good information. Are you suggesting that C40 oil would be better in a turbo charged engine without a GFP? I understand this would be to help with LSPI but is the C40 oil misible with A40 oils? I assume that a Turbo vehicle (e.g.’ 718 or 991.2) in the USA would have shipped with A 40 oil.
Good information. Are you suggesting that C40 oil would be better in a turbo charged engine without a GFP? I understand this would be to help with LSPI but is the C40 oil misible with A40 oils? I assume that a Turbo vehicle (e.g.’ 718 or 991.2) in the USA would have shipped with A 40 oil.
Thanks
Yes. If you have a direct injected engine that has forced induction, the C40 oil would be much more appropriate than the A40. It has to do with the levels of calcium detergents in the A40 oil being too high which is the primary contributor to LSPI in GDI (gasoline direct injection) engines with forced induction.
I chatted with a Mobil 1 rep during the French Lick Parade about the availability of the C40 speced oil. She stated that indeed, it's basically only available at the US Porsche dealerships but was hopeful that it would become more available in other outlets (Amazon?) during the first quarter of 2022. I still wonder if there was some sort of deal between Mobil 1 and Porsche to keep the availability of this specific oil limited to Porsche dealers for about a year or so??
I chatted with a Mobil 1 rep during the French Lick Parade about the availability of the C40 speced oil. She stated that indeed, it's basically only available at the US Porsche dealerships but was hopeful that it would become more available in other outlets (Amazon?) during the first quarter of 2022. I still wonder if there was some sort of deal between Mobil 1 and Porsche to keep the availability of this specific oil limited to Porsche dealers for about a year or so??
Suspect but possible I guess, here is a picture of a 1l container dated back in 2018... seems a long time for Mobil 1 to help keep Porsche the exclusive source for this product...
Yes, the only reason to run the C40 in a normally aspirated engine would be to protect the particulate filter (if equipped). As the Euro 6 standard requires a GFP on all cars in Europe, the C40 oil would meet the ACEA C2/C3 specifications for sulfated ash to protect them. The main reason to run a C40 over the A40 oil is for turbocharged engines as an A40 oil does not provide protection for LSPI due to high calcium detergent levels which must be much lower to prevent LSPI.
Good information. Are you suggesting that C40 oil would be better in a turbo charged engine without a GFP? I understand this would be to help with LSPI but is the C40 oil misible with A40 oils? I assume that a Turbo vehicle (e.g.’ 718 or 991.2) in the USA without the GFP would have shipped with A 40 oil. Also would the drain intervals then decrease (e.g., 3000 miles (C40) from 5000 miles? (A40)..
San Diego. There was a time when there was an extreme shortage of this oil even at dealers but I think we're past that now so you should be able to find at your local dealer. I like to have a couple of quarts on hand in case I need to top off in between oil services. In this case, I was actually at minimum oil after 4500 miles but instead of toping off, I figured I would just do an break in oil service.
06-10-2021, 01:23 PM
