Matrix headlights in USA now--or not?
12-07-2023, 01:31 AM
#16
Drifting
I would be very very careful in proceeding with swapping LED headlights for Matrix headlights - story follows:
now YMMV - but this is a factual story for a North American Cayenne eHybrid Platinum delivered in spring of 2023 - retrofit was _NOT_ plausible even with factory porsche germany support at the local dealership.
proceed with caution - if you purchase parts I'd make sure you can obtain a refund if you can't use them.
- good friend ordered 2023 Cayenne eHybrid Platinum
- really really really wanted matrix headlights
- but supply chain issues - no matrix for his order with out major delay
- decided to proceed with order - no matrix
- porsche really really delay'd order - but car was delivered with LED non-matrix headlights
- he was upset
- porsche asked what they could do to make him happy
- he suggested factory support for matrix retrofit by his local dealer shop
- porsche agreed- sent all parts to dealer service and told them PCNA and Germany would support matrix retrofit
- dealer received all parts and instructions from porsche germany for the retrofit
- dealer worked the problem for 2-3 weeks - was unable to properly retrofit matrix headlights due to deep internal wireharness issues beyond the scope of reasonable retrofit
- porsche germany was surprised by this but after a few days delay confirmed necessary harness support for matrix is "baked in" to the vehicle very very early in assembly process - for Cayenne it is simply not practical to retrofit matrix due to differences it the 1st/main/major/primary harness package installed - you basically have to tear the car down to it's original just exiting paintshop state to replace this main harness
- now anything is possible with sufficient time/money - but tearing down a Cayenne to it's state when it exits the paint shop is _NOT_ a practical reality
- porsche germany was also unable to determine if there were other assembly differences that would be "discovered" in a retro fit process
- after long delay - porsche germany and local dealer determined matrix retrofit was not feasible due to "unfixable" wireharness problems with the main/bulk harness
- plan was called off due to cost/practicality issues even with factory engineering support
- you can tell if a Macan/Panamera is North American or ROW (Rest of World) even before it enters the paintshop - bare metal body stage of manufacturing
- how?
- it has the hole cut out in the roof panel for the XM sat. antenna which is North America only - and leads to a very very very different "roofing harness" that changes nearly _EVERYTHING_ for that car down the line
now YMMV - but this is a factual story for a North American Cayenne eHybrid Platinum delivered in spring of 2023 - retrofit was _NOT_ plausible even with factory porsche germany support at the local dealership.
proceed with caution - if you purchase parts I'd make sure you can obtain a refund if you can't use them.
Last edited by kayjh; 12-07-2023 at 08:02 PM.
12-07-2023, 01:40 AM
#17
Rennlist Member
and I didn't say they don't know (although they underestimated) they determined it was not practical to retrofit them - if you have them you can activate them - but if you don't have them it's nearly impossible to retrofit them with out tearing the entire vehicle apart.
Last edited by daveo4porsche; 12-07-2023 at 01:42 AM.
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Needsdecaf (12-07-2023)
12-07-2023, 10:44 AM
#18
In May I reached out to someone who mentioned being able to enable this.
My Taycan has the Porsche Dynamic Light System Plus, I asked if retrofitting the Matrix lights and enabling them would be possible, here is the response;
Retrofits will also be able to be activated as long as you have camera on the windshields.
My Taycan has the Porsche Dynamic Light System Plus, I asked if retrofitting the Matrix lights and enabling them would be possible, here is the response;
Retrofits will also be able to be activated as long as you have camera on the windshields.
Last edited by Silververtu; 12-07-2023 at 10:45 AM.
12-10-2023, 06:19 PM
#20
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daveo4porsche (12-10-2023)
02-11-2024, 09:18 AM
#21
1st Gear
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02-11-2024, 10:46 AM
#23
02-11-2024, 10:51 AM
#24
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/18/business/us-approves-smart-headlights.html
There’s a catch -
However, the A.D.B. system allowed by the federal agency will not be identical to those used in the rest of the world. While the infrastructure bill called for the standard approved by the Society of Automotive Engineers, which is similar to the system used in most other countries, the agency modified it, citing in its 326-page rule a Supreme Court decision that gave it the right to do so.
The problem, according to one lighting expert, is that while U.S. vehicles can soon be equipped with headlamps that use dynamically reshaping high beams to prevent glare, their light output still cannot exceed the standard set in the 1970s, which is a fraction of the light intensity allowed globally.
“Adaptive driving beam technology in the rest of the world can increase seeing and reduce glare to a greater degree than what NHTSA has specified,” said Daniel Stern, chief editor of Driving Vision News, a technical journal about global vehicle lighting and driver assistance systems.
“The U.S. has left in place an ancient cap on high-beam intensity from the late 1970s,” Mr. Stern said. “It’s a regulatory island.”
Given the length of the report, few have had the opportunity to digest its contents. Both General Motors and the Society of Automotive Engineers have reserved judgment on the new smart headlight rules.
There’s a catch -
However, the A.D.B. system allowed by the federal agency will not be identical to those used in the rest of the world. While the infrastructure bill called for the standard approved by the Society of Automotive Engineers, which is similar to the system used in most other countries, the agency modified it, citing in its 326-page rule a Supreme Court decision that gave it the right to do so.
The problem, according to one lighting expert, is that while U.S. vehicles can soon be equipped with headlamps that use dynamically reshaping high beams to prevent glare, their light output still cannot exceed the standard set in the 1970s, which is a fraction of the light intensity allowed globally.
“Adaptive driving beam technology in the rest of the world can increase seeing and reduce glare to a greater degree than what NHTSA has specified,” said Daniel Stern, chief editor of Driving Vision News, a technical journal about global vehicle lighting and driver assistance systems.
“The U.S. has left in place an ancient cap on high-beam intensity from the late 1970s,” Mr. Stern said. “It’s a regulatory island.”
Given the length of the report, few have had the opportunity to digest its contents. Both General Motors and the Society of Automotive Engineers have reserved judgment on the new smart headlight rules.
02-11-2024, 10:53 AM
#25
02-11-2024, 03:15 PM
#26
They're still described as "LED-Matrix Design" which has meant a non-functional matrix feature. These are however very likely the same headlights as ROW and could be activated with programming.
As desirable as this feature sounds in theory, I'm not sure it's a good idea to have everyone on the road running around with their brights on relying on the sensors to respond quickly enough. The simple auto high beam feature doesn't respond until it sees the oncoming car's headlights usually dipping the lights in many situations a few moments too late.
As desirable as this feature sounds in theory, I'm not sure it's a good idea to have everyone on the road running around with their brights on relying on the sensors to respond quickly enough. The simple auto high beam feature doesn't respond until it sees the oncoming car's headlights usually dipping the lights in many situations a few moments too late.
02-15-2024, 11:46 AM
#28
latest article from CNN on this subject ...
https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/15/cars/...ars/index.html
seems like NHTSA wants a completely new design of ADB headlights from car manufacturers so to meet their requirements .... so, many more years of wait for US drivers.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/15/cars/...ars/index.html
seems like NHTSA wants a completely new design of ADB headlights from car manufacturers so to meet their requirements .... so, many more years of wait for US drivers.
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CodyBigdog (02-15-2024)
02-15-2024, 12:59 PM
#29
latest article from CNN on this subject ...
https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/15/cars/...ars/index.html
seems like NHTSA wants a completely new design of ADB headlights from car manufacturers so to meet their requirements .... so, many more years of wait for US drivers.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/02/15/cars/...ars/index.html
seems like NHTSA wants a completely new design of ADB headlights from car manufacturers so to meet their requirements .... so, many more years of wait for US drivers.
This is just utter arrogance on the part of the NHTSA. .
So what the NHTSA is basically saying is….what’s good/works for drivers in most parts of the world, is not good (enough) for America? So we remain using old, inferior technology. Stupid.
Last edited by CodyBigdog; 02-15-2024 at 01:01 PM.
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thebishman (02-15-2024)
02-15-2024, 03:00 PM
#30
Burning Brakes
The NHTSA has had their heads up their a___es for as long as I can remember on headlights. I started installing euro H4 lights in my car back in the 1970s due to the horrible US sealed beam headlights. (Have had them in my 944 since I bought it in 1987, plus other cars as well.) I got into a email "discussion" with one of the NHTSA bureaucrats about 20 years ago. His attitude, while seemingly open, was as bad as you can imagine.
Dan Stern knows his stuff and has been a critic of the NHTSA for as long as I've known about him. (Back in pre-web usenet days in the 1980s.) I've emailed him on stuff in the way distant past too.
The silver lining is that the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety finally pulled down the NHTSA's pants back in 2016 with their testing of various manufacturers headlights. Failed many/most of them - even though they were within NHTSA's specs. Here is their current page: https://www.iihs.org/topics/headlights
After the IIHS did their initial study, I sent them an email congratulating them on it. Got a nice response back from the fellow in charge of it!