Blowing out our 911R
#271
Race Director
I've yet to meet and talk to in person, not on a forum, someone who bought an R that thought it was worth a penny more than MSRP.
Every single one of them sold their cars.
Now don't get me wrong, they all said it's a great car and they really enjoyed it, but also realized the massive hype and cashed in big time.
Some of these guys have more than enough money to hang on to the car if they loved it that much...they all sold them.
Plus there's a ton of them for sale...you can't seem to walk in to a Porsche dealer without at least one to 4 of them there sitting for sale.
Every single one of them sold their cars.
Now don't get me wrong, they all said it's a great car and they really enjoyed it, but also realized the massive hype and cashed in big time.
Some of these guys have more than enough money to hang on to the car if they loved it that much...they all sold them.
Plus there's a ton of them for sale...you can't seem to walk in to a Porsche dealer without at least one to 4 of them there sitting for sale.
But for some of the insane prices some paid I think they already know they called it wrong. There was a reason a bunch of R Owners were calling PAG bitching about the .2GT3. But remember - Porsche did not tell these people that this car would appreciate or they would protect Ownership
#272
Rennlist Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Mid-Atlantic (on land, not in the middle of the ocean)
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Some people started rationalizing overpaying based on speculation, and now they'll get burned after the bubble bursts. This is a textbook bubble. Amazing how so many people can only see bubbles in retrospect, despite all the warning signs screaming at them. I need to figure out a way to short this car ...
#273
Rennlist Member
Imagine the values on the R if Porsche went through with their original plan to offer the new GT3 sans wing...they acquiesced to the R owners and dealers this time...will they next time around??
#274
Rennlist Member
The world will be a better place when the 918 VIP program ends. Even dealers will quietly admit it. They see what it's done, and are over it. They should be, since they are the ones who created the monster.
#275
Banned
STG you should go do some work for Comedy Central. I enjoy checking in on this thread to see your posts and I totally agree with post #256. It is always the great debate ender when the advisory has nothing fact based left to say, they revert to "oh you must be jealous".
#276
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by bigmacsmallfries
Numbered plaque? Great psychological gimmick though to hold values.
964 30 year anniversary editions with widebody, although a leftover parts bin exercise, are valued by the market today.
996 40 year anniversary is not loved because of unreliable engine and unconventional shape.
It goes to show engineering design is more important to consumers than a numbered plaque or marketing exercise from Porsche.
#277
Banned
Well the dealers that are not actually part of the VIP program will be happy. The ones that bought the 918 and are in it, love it. They are making more money than they know what to do with.
#278
Rennlist Member
Not sure if this question has been asked/answered, but where are they trading now? I see a metric ton for sale and haven't heard of a single transaction*. Last one to sell publicly was is June @ $380k. That car had all of the right boxes checked and traded in Italy at auction, where we tend to see a 10-15% Porsche premium.
Does that mean these cars are at $330-350k??? I think less.
I understand and appreciate the vitriol here, but I'm in for one of these in an off color at $270k. Would much rather own the R than a similarly spec'ed .2 GT3 even at a $50k premium. It's a cool car that filled a much needed void for Porsche at the time. There will always be newer and better versions.
*dealers, spare me the "many have traded privately at staggering price tags". Bull****. Let's see the comps on these cars; I am genuinely curious where the real, transactional market it
Does that mean these cars are at $330-350k??? I think less.
I understand and appreciate the vitriol here, but I'm in for one of these in an off color at $270k. Would much rather own the R than a similarly spec'ed .2 GT3 even at a $50k premium. It's a cool car that filled a much needed void for Porsche at the time. There will always be newer and better versions.
*dealers, spare me the "many have traded privately at staggering price tags". Bull****. Let's see the comps on these cars; I am genuinely curious where the real, transactional market it
#279
Rennlist Member
I think you see a lot of dealers putting .2 GT3's in the hands of people they know will own them, and drive them.....Porsche has multiple mea-culpas going on right now.
#280
Race Director
Originally Posted by goin2drt
STG you should go do some work for Comedy Central. I enjoy checking in on this thread to see your posts and I totally agree with post #256. It is always the great debate ender when the advisory has nothing fact based left to say, they revert to "oh you must be jealous".
#281
Race Director
Originally Posted by RobbieRob
Best thread ever, I'm dying laughing at all the comments. STG, dude, you made water come out of my nose on a couple of your comments(I will remember not to drink anything while reading in the future). Great stuff.
Thanks
Some ideas just pop in my head and go with it. Time consuming with the photo stuff, but worth it if someone enjoys it.
#282
eBay is another place to find available 911Rs. How long before we see Ron Popeil come out of retirement to shill them? I kid...
#283
I understand and appreciate the vitriol here, but I'm in for one of these in an off color at $270k. Would much rather own the R than a similarly spec'ed .2 GT3 even at a $50k premium. It's a cool car that filled a much needed void for Porsche at the time. There will always be newer and better versions.
Seriously, the funny thing about this thread is that, everybody, save for maybe the OP, agrees that the R's currently for sale are ridiculously overpriced. The debate is whether it's worth any premium over sticker or whether it's basically a C2S with more HP. I'm with you, though not quite as high. The R is probably the only car I'd pay a premium over sticker for, but it would still be pretty small, $20-25k max, assuming it was my perfect spec. But I don't think it's going to trade in that range for a long, long time, assuming we're not in WW III shortly, which looks more likely by the day.
#284
Race Director
The real bubble issue here is that original owners got bought out of their allocations for $xxx,xxx.oo and those guys have flipped them again.
Or dealers are in on it, and split the proceeds 50/50 with the R owners who never took the car home. Was put away just long enough to run out the time clock on the penalty.
You see it with the OP here. Selling 991.2 allocations for $30K. They pay some dealer who wants to be discreet $15K for the allocation and flip it for $30K.
Look how many RS's are out there. Almost as many as all pre-owned 991.1 GT3's. These flippers are into these cars deep and will get burned soon.
The guys willing to pay crazy prices for these cars want the latest and greatest and move on quickly. The 991.1 RS and R are old news to them already. That market is drying up.
The "gotta have the latest hot car guys" pay big mark ups, not the enthusiasts. The thing is, the latest hot car becomes old very quickly.
It's all entertaining to watch from the sidelines from NO vested interest. The other bias's are very evident.
Or dealers are in on it, and split the proceeds 50/50 with the R owners who never took the car home. Was put away just long enough to run out the time clock on the penalty.
You see it with the OP here. Selling 991.2 allocations for $30K. They pay some dealer who wants to be discreet $15K for the allocation and flip it for $30K.
Look how many RS's are out there. Almost as many as all pre-owned 991.1 GT3's. These flippers are into these cars deep and will get burned soon.
The guys willing to pay crazy prices for these cars want the latest and greatest and move on quickly. The 991.1 RS and R are old news to them already. That market is drying up.
The "gotta have the latest hot car guys" pay big mark ups, not the enthusiasts. The thing is, the latest hot car becomes old very quickly.
It's all entertaining to watch from the sidelines from NO vested interest. The other bias's are very evident.
#285
"...and if you paid half a million quid for a 911 R last week - you're a ****ing idiot."
- Jethro Bovingdon
I guess he's one of those sour grapes haters too except that he's actually driven both cars
https://youtu.be/Ts2OWUM-erU?t=264
- Jethro Bovingdon
I guess he's one of those sour grapes haters too except that he's actually driven both cars
https://youtu.be/Ts2OWUM-erU?t=264