Christien

Yeah, me too. I'm working excel spreadsheets as using rennlist as an all-too-often break, but now I'm seeing numbers and operators when I look up...

No, I won't be at the dec. 8 gtg unfortunately - we're in montreal that weekend. Hope to be at the next one, esp. if can get the 944 back on the road in time.

(do you dealer guys remember those? just kidding)

imcarthur

That b*stard. He was supposed to call me when he is in town. He used to be a rep for me in South Florida.

Ian

Pfaff Tuning GM

Christien,

We have 2 techs that were around in the 944 days, as a matter of act one of them just won the PCNA tech competition and has ben crowned the "Top Porsche Technician" in North America.

He is an awesome tech and knows the old cars very well.

I just picked up a 1985 1/2 944 to make into a track car. I also havemy own company that runds track events. www.apexdrving.ca

Pfaff Porsche GM

Christien-There is a difference between dealer and PCNA. One thing I will say is you dont bite the hand that feeds you. Porsche is one of if not the best manufactures in the world and not many people can argue with that. Dealers in Canada loose business everytime someone buys a car from the US and brings it up to Canada so guess what our position is in all of this? We fight the fight but in a politically correct fashion. Every single person who has purchased a US car is hurting the value of ALL Porsches in Canada. We purchase 700 new and used cars a year so you can only guess what our feelings are in all of this. Canada is seperating on January 1st and will become Porsche Cars Canada. We know this will help but to what extent still remains unclear at this point. I will go on the record to say that Canadian dealers ARE NOT pressuring PCNA to keep prices where they are. We have zero benefit to that happening. We believe in staying true to the Canadian vehicles. So true in fact that we to this day are still refusing to do what some of you are doing in bringing cars up from the US. We could easily go down, buy 20 vehicles and bring them here to resell and probably make a lot of money doing it. The integrity of the brand and Pfaff is too strong for us to sell out that way for the purpose of some profit. We might be forced into doing this down the road depending on what happens but for now, we will only sell Canadian cars. This issue can be debated for a long time but the bottom line is we are effected by it and unfortunately its hurting all customers including the dealers. Its not customer vs. dealer. Dealers are on the same side as customers, because without customers, we dont have a business.

Christien

[QUOTE=Pfaff Porsche GM;4827879]Every single person who has purchased a US car is hurting the value of ALL Porsches in Canada.[quote]

But only because of the fact that Canadian prices are artificially inflated above market value.

But surely you understand that customer truly couldn't give a flying f**k one way or the other WHY the price is higher or whose fault it is, just that it is indeed higher, and they'll always go where the price is lower. No customer is going to shop at the more expensive place simply because they feel badly for the individual dealer because he's getting screwed. Ok, some will out of loyalty, no doubt, but certainly not many.

And again, my point in all this is Pfaff never lifted one finger to explain any of this to the community until sales really began to be hit hard. Who knows, maybe if they'd got the club, customers, enthusiasts and consumer advocates online sooner there could have been a massive protest made against PCNA several years ago, forcing them to lower prices. The CDN dealers could have banded together to take a united stand against PCNA and appealed to PAG, who surely would be unhappy to hear of all this. Sure Canada isn't as big a market as the US, but sales are still sales, and I'm sure PAG would be unhappy if, say the CDN delaers boycotted PCNA and would only sell used cars they themselves imported from the states. I understand completely what you're saying about biting the hand that feeds, that makes perfect sense, but if all the CDN dealerships united against PCNA, surely they could exert pressure. I'm sure PCNA wouldn't want to jeopardize the entire CDN market. And again, I'm sure if PAG heard about this kind of action they be furious.

Pfaff Porsche GM

I didnt say that I blame people for buying US or that people are crazy for buying US or anything like that. I was simply stating a fact that the laws of supply and demand come into play here and US cars in Canada are hurting the resale values of ALL Porsche cars. That is a fact that is hard to argue. No right or wrong or finger pointing, just a fact of supply and demand. As far as what we could have done better, I agree. This is all new to almost everyone in this industry and there is no prerequisite here as to what we can do. If our crystal ball was working, we could have done things different. Hind site is 20/20. My parents have a boat and the name of it is "Never 2 Late" I guess the point is better late then never. I will also say that the dealers are together and talking directly to PCNA and PAG about the situation. They are very aware but there is no quick fix here. The dealers firmly believe that buying US cars is not the answer and we are staying true to the Canadian cars and the customers who drive them. I know you dont believe this but the resale value of a US car is less in Canada by quite a bit. We at this point dont want to sell out and buy these cars for the purpose of resale and possible profit. Christien, We both share the same passion for the brand and I love that. We can go back and forth all day about what if's and what we should have done. You are correct, things could have been done different but we do realize that all of us are still here talking because we share the same passion for the brand and that will never change. If you ever want to sit down and discuss this, let me know. The Cappuccino is on me.

Christien

Wow, Phil. I knew you had Pfaff and DFC look for a car for you and couldn't find one within several months, but I had no idea just how big the discrepancy was once they finally did find one.

Eric, I'm a small business owner and if one of my customers came to me with a story like that I'd be absolutely livid that I was forced to be non-competitive by another party over which I had no control. Here's a customer who gave SEVEN MONTHS and wasn't helped. I mean, that's beyond unfair - I would think it's impossible to stay afloat in a market like that, and I would throw political correctness, biting the hand that feeds, etc. to the wind and go after the heads of whomever sets the pricing, because if I didn't, I'd see my company going out of business, fast.

Christien

Ha! Thanks!

You're right, I think we could go back and forth on it all day, and it's all really just a matter of perspective.

And again, I'm not the person you should be wasting time with, because I'm not, nor will I likely ever be, in the market for a new car, Porsche or otherwise. I always buy used, cash - the depreciation hit is just way too much. So by the supply and demand rule, the more the value of ALL Porsches is lowered, the happier I am when I'm looking for that GT3!

GREEK-TURBO-RACER

Meise you big piece of $hit .... doing great thanks !! It's been too long my friend . Hope you have been well. I hope you can come and see me down here in the spring as well and have some beers. Here is some contact info.

theo@gtautowerks.com

Theo

Pfaff Porsche GM

Phil- at no time did I say that the money saved would be lost to resale value. I am getting my information from our customers who are telling us that they will pay more for a Canadian car over a US car.


Pongobaz-I will stand by what I said before that every US car that is brought up is business lost. I agree that some people would stretch into one of these cars and would not be able to do it without going to the US because of the price drop and that is EXACTLY my point. That price difference should not be there are we should be able to sell you the same car for the same price here in Canada. So in fact we did loose that sale because the bottom line is that you did purchase a Porsche but not from a Canadian dealer. Why?- Because it was cheaper. So if we didnt have any exchange rate issues then there would be no need for you to go down to purchase, you could do it right here in Canada. So we did loose that business.

qik1320

The bottom line is somebody who bought a 911 4 years ago like an 03-04 c4s could have been depending on a certain value at the end of their lease or whatever the case based on the formula we've seen with 911's in the past. With the importation of all these plus 20k lower price cars the value has now dropped significantly. These are the people that the dealer has to look after as that's usually their customer base. I believe that is why the dealers are firm on keeping canadian inventory only.

It's pretty simple, there are 2 markets for Porsche these days in Canada and somebodies got to come first and that is their vehicle purchasing market!

You guys can fight all day, but the dealer has to look after people in their showroom first, they're in there, laying down huge dough for the car of their dreams and a promise of care!!! After all those are the only customers putting turst in the dealer right from the start!

I'd look after them first if it were my business. No apology needed to the others in my opinion.

jumper5836

Some feedback for you.

Both my wife and I service both our vehicles at Pfaff, the rentals cars are just terrible. Unwashed, dusty and filthy inside. The choice of cars are crap. If they are going to go that cheap they should choose small cars. Not SUVs/Crossovers and large gas guzzlers. A small clean car is much better then having a dirty Crysler 300C or Buick Rendezvous

You should seriously look into a new rental company. I believe there is actually one out there where they rent VW jettas

Pfaff Porsche GM

Wow Jumper, were you at my Managers meeting on Monday?? That is exactly one of the things we spoke about. We are currently looking at 3 different alternatives including increasing our Valet fleet which is currently at 12 Cayenne's now. I will keep you posted as to what we decide to do. Thanks for your feedback.

Jaak Lepson

With regards to the USA cars coming into Canada ... one area is overlooked ... SERVICE. These cars do need to be serviced and the dealer does make a good profit from the service. Usually these cars are out of warranty and the customer is footing the repair bill. Dealers do not just make their profit from sales ... service is a huge profit centre as well. When dealers "downplay" the US cars ... they are losing the "service" customer to the independent P-Car shops who do pick up the slack ... and they will! To spite a non-Canadian customer ... drives them to the other shops and does affect the dealers bottom line. Less service customers = less profits. So someone got it in the states ... open your service bays and service the hell out of them. Besides, they are paying the FULL freight ... not warranty!

Pfaff Porsche GM

Jaak- another reason why we are looking at our loaner and Valet program.