mark kibort

Peter, totally agree.. just adding the factors that are beyond min standards of functionality, and providing some thoughts on the topic when folks take the street stuff to the track.

I think the best comparison is cars driving down a steep, long decent.
one car smokes the brakes and has no pedal and near complete brake failure and the other is fine. whats the difference? both are deceling or maintaining speed at the same levels, yet one fails...........why? The reason is in heat dissipation. its the reason that one brake set up can work for some and not for others. to complete the comparison /analogy..... one driver can ride the brakes ever so slightly and have complete failure. while another can use quick stabs that slow the car down in .5 seconds with a higher rate of decel, but allow for little localized surface heat build up, and rapid dissipation of the heat upon release. the other slow heat generation that ends up saturation the sytem in very little time.

getting back to the op's original question. sure, you beef up the system of a DE car and it might be near immune to brake issues. however, you use some technique and you can a minimal system work just fine for a DE weekend.

TrackDays247.com

Time for levity. My rotor from Red Bull RB4 F1 car.

Berringer

DrCGuerra

Does anyone know if the brake pads from a 991.1 GT3 fit the brakes for a 991.1 GTS (non-PCCB)? Thanks

the_vetman

^^No bueno.

DrCGuerra

Thanks

Clark-ApexPerformance

The rear pads are completely different than the GT3. The 991S and GTS front caliper is actually the same as the GT3 but because of the hats design you cannot run the GT3 pad. However if you go to Giro Disc rotors in the front you can run the GT3 pads. Have several 991S and GTS running this setup and they are very happy with the improved braking.

85Gold

Hawk DTC pads dust is very corrosive. If it gets wet it will corrode your wheels. Just say no to EBC. Carbotech, G-Loc pads are very finicky about bedding especially if you run another brand of pads for street driving on the same rotors. The stock pads for occasional DE are adequate. After that I like PFC and Ferodo if you don't mind a lot of brake squeel on the street.

All is from my own personal experience.

Peter

Peter

mark kibort

I think EBC were the hardest to bed for street use, but the majority of race pads can be used with no noise on the street. I would say, pagid orange or black are the best bets, with PFC08 or 11s as second choice. Its all in the bedding on a green rotor that allows for street use. PM me and illl give you the process.
this is 20 years of dual purpose street and race, with NO squealing! ever! track or street. PCF01, 11, 08, pagid R-4-4, RS14, ST41, S4, EBC orange, and many others..

erko1905

It's been a while since I started this thread but it seems to have bumped back up - so I'll give some feedback on how things went. This was my green group student experience so obviously YMMV.

I listened to the consensus and attended a 2-day event at NJMP Thunderbolt (green group, NNJR PCA) early June with stock pads and stock fluid. Fluid was very recently flushed by the dealer when they fixed a leak issue under warranty, and stock pads were roughly at about 75% front and maybe 30-40% on the rears in terms of pad amount left. Rear pads were definitely running fairly low, low enough that I passed tech but was told that it was OK only because I was in the green group but probably wouldn'tve passed for higher groups.

Anyways, long story short, stock pads and fluid setup didn't really work so well, for me anyways. Especially on the second day, the stock pads completely disintegrated and melted in the afternoon; rotors were covered with pad material, drilled holes all full of brake pad, large streaks of pad material on the rotor etc, significant vibration on pedal, with serious fade. I'm guessing the fluid boiled as well since pedal was getting fairly squishy, and later on when bleeding the brakes there were some bubbles.

Second half of day two, I was definitely needing to brake earlier and longer, and especially the braking at the end of the main straight started getting pretty scary, trying to slow down from 120 w vibrating/squishy long brake pedal. I checked the data and it looks like I managed my best lap of the weekend about midday on day two, second session, and I mostly slowed down in the afternoon sessions, even though I thought I was still improving with consistency and smoothness of line/inputs etc. In general, having to deal with longer braking distances while trying to learn where to start braking wasn't too helpful for me as a beginner.

Just to put this in some sort of context and/or frame of reference and nothing else, my general pace after I learned the line with no traffic was in the low-ish one forties, with best lap at 1:41:28. I guess I might take some heat for measuring lap times at first time on the track.

Overall, first track event ever, I had an absolute blast, and I successfully and safely decelerated when/where I needed to throughout the event. It just didn't feel very good for the latter portion of the weekend. As mentioned in previous posts, it could be skill related; it could be related to me driving solo w no instructor and thereby driving worse in the last two sessions; or maybe I was already just braking way too soft way too long all along and pads finally gave up or maybe the modern 991s are just too powerful and too heavy for the stock pads on track.

At the end of the weekend, I had barely any pad material left on the stock pads. Since I'm going to three more events fairly soon and melting through more stock pads didn't seem cost efficient or safe or fun, I swapped in some Pagid RSL29s instead. I know the consensus advice was to stick w the stock pads for a while, and I'm glad I did stick w them for my first event and saw through how they did, but a heavier duty compound will probably work better for me, at least I hope, through the summer.

gbuff

I bed my front XP12s by putting them on at home and then driving to the track; never an issue with them.

OP: New pads, OK, but absolutely change the fluid....Motul 600 works well w/o spending mondo $$$$ on SRF. That'll be for later when you really start spending

Gary

Manifold

I've routinely used various full track pads on the street with no significant issues on the street as far as noise, friction, etc. That's the route I'd recommend if tracking with any regularity.

g-50cab

Brakes, wheels and tires - don't skimp. that being said - many have their preference for pads - some work better in different heat ranges.

All these variables change - mostly reliant on Horsepower of the car, weight of the car, tire size and compound. The last variables are the track itself and braking technique.

My experience on newer drivers - is their braking technique on the track is not ideal - and they end up heating up the brakes more than normal. With stock pads - this means you can go through a whole set of pads in a day (sometimes a session at Sebring)

Ask around at the track where you DE - you should get some recommendations on what works in that environment - then stay with a reputable brand - Change pads and fluid at every event and you should be good to go.

This is a subject that I am passionate about. as a student I've lost my brakes going into turn 7 - and as an instructor I've had several students that have lost brakes in various parts of the track - yes, even in the green group...

mark kibort

put on a set of pagid oranges or blacks and call it a day. works fine street or track and will never be an issue on the track. why mess around.

Glyndellis

My wife disagrees with Pagid black RS14 on the road. The first time I returned from the track after installing them, she was outside with the dog to witness the screech and merely said "I assume you're changing those back to the standard ones after the weekend".

YMMV - these are my experiences and I continue to keep my wife happy. Happy wife, happy DEs.