Short shift to drive faster on track...
06-22-2016, 12:37 PM
#1
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Short shift to drive faster on track...
As many here know, I have been preaching this for years. Nice to see it discussed by Ross Bentley as well...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiL7...ature=youtu.be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiL7...ature=youtu.be
06-22-2016, 02:37 PM
#3
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Yup! I am about 2-5mph faster into the bus stop depending on how big the ***** are that day when short shifting vs shifting at the top of the esses.
More stable in a higher gear, plus I lift into 2, so might as well make that upshift pause in acceleration part of the T2 lift in a way.
More stable in a higher gear, plus I lift into 2, so might as well make that upshift pause in acceleration part of the T2 lift in a way.
06-22-2016, 02:42 PM
#4
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Into the Esses and down into T12 at Road Atlanta, up a gear in the middle of the Snake and before the Uphill Esses at VIR, Turn 6 at Mont Tremblant, before the Chute at Summit and down the hill before the Downhill at LRP, a bunch of different places that helps...
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www.peterkrause.net
www.gofasternow.com
"Combining the Art and Science of Driving Fast!"
Specializing in Professional, Private Driver Performance Evaluation and Optimization
Consultation Available Remotely and at VIRginia International Raceway
06-22-2016, 03:29 PM
#5
Not continually banging the tach off the red line also help oil temps. So if your motor's power falls off before redline you are faster and kinder to the motor at the same time.
Dave, if we get the opportunity, I'd like you to take the old girl out to TWS again and run some laps with T6 like you usually do, downshifting to 3rd, and some laps just taking T6 in 4th. I don't see a lick of difference when I compare them. Sure it's below the power peak, about 3800 RPM in T6, but there is no loss in the 3-4 upshift required after coming out of T6 if one downshifts. Since you are faster there, I would think the difference would be even less for you as the more speed carried through T6 the less the 3rd gear downshift helps.
-Mike
Dave, if we get the opportunity, I'd like you to take the old girl out to TWS again and run some laps with T6 like you usually do, downshifting to 3rd, and some laps just taking T6 in 4th. I don't see a lick of difference when I compare them. Sure it's below the power peak, about 3800 RPM in T6, but there is no loss in the 3-4 upshift required after coming out of T6 if one downshifts. Since you are faster there, I would think the difference would be even less for you as the more speed carried through T6 the less the 3rd gear downshift helps.
-Mike
Last edited by TXE36; 06-22-2016 at 07:18 PM.
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06-22-2016, 06:12 PM
#9
How do you short shift with PDK? I totally agree no need to go to red line with a manual . My ECU was remapped so I have a little extra grunt up top but I try never to even bounce off rev limiter.
06-22-2016, 06:41 PM
#11
Burning Brakes
There are still plenty of reasons to short shift a paddle or sequential transmission car.
Under power you control the forward load and slip of the rear tires with the throttle, just like you control the side load of the front tires with the steering wheel. How you use the throttle and what gear you're in controls the load the tire gets.
Also, short shifting is very useful in damp/wet conditions or whenever traction is not optimal (think high horse power car coming out of a hairpin in 1st gear). With or without real traction control.
edit: forgot to add, but in the same vain as short shifting -- rolling taller gears into/through some corners. it will generally add stability and make the car easier to drive through fast corners. of course, that's not always what you want. also, be careful of allowing the engine to over-slow you in corners with big gaps between braking and power application. this tends to give you the sensation that you were on the limit (engine braking causing the car to feel a little loose due to effectively increasing rear brake bias), but you most likely could have been rolling more speed in with a more stable platform.
-mike
Under power you control the forward load and slip of the rear tires with the throttle, just like you control the side load of the front tires with the steering wheel. How you use the throttle and what gear you're in controls the load the tire gets.
Also, short shifting is very useful in damp/wet conditions or whenever traction is not optimal (think high horse power car coming out of a hairpin in 1st gear). With or without real traction control.
edit: forgot to add, but in the same vain as short shifting -- rolling taller gears into/through some corners. it will generally add stability and make the car easier to drive through fast corners. of course, that's not always what you want. also, be careful of allowing the engine to over-slow you in corners with big gaps between braking and power application. this tends to give you the sensation that you were on the limit (engine braking causing the car to feel a little loose due to effectively increasing rear brake bias), but you most likely could have been rolling more speed in with a more stable platform.
-mike
06-22-2016, 08:01 PM
#12
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Spot on Mike
Glad it has helped you, Tom! As Peter points out, this technique is if high value at nearly every track, COTA being another one (in several places). Despite the occasional erroneous claim here otherwise...
Glad it has helped you, Tom! As Peter points out, this technique is if high value at nearly every track, COTA being another one (in several places). Despite the occasional erroneous claim here otherwise...
Last edited by Veloce Raptor; 06-22-2016 at 09:06 PM.
06-22-2016, 08:30 PM
#13
Rennlist Member
While looking at my data it's funny how the laps with the impressive speeds in the straights between the corners do not yield my overall best lap times.
Short shifting at the right point is just another way to be smooth
06-22-2016, 10:09 PM
#15
Three Wheelin'
To me this is 101. Very obvious as one devotes attention to trying to solve puzzle pieces to get faster laptimes or achieve some other result.
Even though I have been at this for nearly 30 years, I have not had to solve a lot of puzzle pieces (under a dozen different tracks/configs with three different cars/configs). Here is a key area where I think guys can use data and coaching to evaluate trade-offs for perhaps more meaningful gains.
Even though I have been at this for nearly 30 years, I have not had to solve a lot of puzzle pieces (under a dozen different tracks/configs with three different cars/configs). Here is a key area where I think guys can use data and coaching to evaluate trade-offs for perhaps more meaningful gains.