mark kibort

its actually 95.8ft-lbs (130Nm)
i like to go a shade lighter, especially if you are taking them on and off very frequently. 90ft-lbs is perfectly fine for track use.

Aspen Autosports

No it isn't and I really hope no one else listens to this bad advice.

Do not under torque your wheels everyone, bring the wheel to the proper torque and prevent any possible harm to yourself or anyone else out there.

mark kibort

90 to 95ftlbs is just fine. it's not bad advice.+/- 5% is perfectly acceptable. no one's wheel is going to go anywhere on the track or road with 90ft-lbs of torque on the nuts. over tightening can have its downsides too.
it's practical advice.
there are many companies that spec 80ft'lbs.

my advice, first off here, is that his warped rotors could be caused by the apes at the shop who use impact guns and then just make sure they are torqued to min spec. that can make one lug near 150ft-lbs and others at the min level of near 90 or 95. that causes rotor warping and thats a problem. my advice is sound and realistic. the range is 85 to 115ftlbs from multiple manufacturers. 90lbs is a good number. some times too tight at the track, can cause problems getting them off and cause breakage. This is 20 years of racing and 1000s of wheel removals at the track.

NYC993

OEM porsche stuff is great, but pads don't last long. I use Pagid Yellow that last much longer. I believe switching back and worth may not be a great idea due to constant rebedding with different pad materials. Unless you only do a couple of events I'd leave track pads in.

mark kibort

as you start pushing the car further and further, you will find the stock pads a little substandard, with very little bite when they get very hot. thats where a dual purpose pad like a Pagid orange works very well. (its classified as race (R-4-4) but i found its fine on the street. bed it correctly and it will give a lot of service with no downsides over stock pads. Pagid yellow is not a bad pad. it's an endurance pad, so it doesn't have the typical racing pad bite, but still quite good.

NYC993

Never found that. Bite of OEM is great on my car, but it has decent size brakes from turbo. I just used up 50% in a weekend. Pagid yellows have been on for 11 days with 30-40% left. From what I read yellow is a better version of orange. Nobody uses orange on my car, either yellow or black or a combo. Blacks are harder on rotors.

morsini

OP sounds like the crack pipe bit him.

OP, for all of us that instruct and have to ride in your car and coach you, please, please please leave your car as close to stock as possible. No, it won't be as fast, but that's a good thing, because what's not being talked about here is the importance of learning the line and execution and you don't need big brakes for that.

morsini

And... When you have a problem, you consult the pros.

http://www.stoptech.com/technical-su...nd-other-myths

Matt Romanowski

You understand that every car is different, right? Just because some Toyota has 3 lug bolts and they are only torqued to 80 pounds doesn't mean that is correct for a Porsche. Porsche specified an exact value for a reason. My Suburban is 140 ft/lbs. Should I use that on the Porsche because some companies us it?

Please, please, please, NO ONE LISTEN TO KIBORT. HE WILL GET YOU HURT.

winders

My air-cooled 911 uses 10.9 M14x1.5 wheel studs. That is the Porsche Factory part. The maximum torque for a 10.9 M14x1.5 fastener is in the 130-140 ft-lbs range depending on the chart you look at.

From what I understand, Porsche is required by TUV rules to use 10.9 material on wheels studs. I also know that Porsche used lug nuts made of lower grade material so the lug nuts would be damaged well before the studs.

I won't comment on the Factory aluminum and steel lug nuts used on the air-cooled 911's, but have always torqued the steel nuts I use to 100 ft-lbs and have never and a problem with the lug nuts coming loose or being damaged. Of course, the steel lug nuts I use are supposed to be better than 8.8 which has a max torque value of ~102 ft-lbs.

The numbers above all assume dry threads.

There is no good reason in the world to use less torque than what is specified. I have no idea what taking the lug nuts on and off often has to with torque values used. It's not like the nuts are being used beyond their elastic limit. They can be used over and over again at the specified torque.

Torquing lug nuts under spec is not a good idea at all as far as I am concerned. Using less torque means you have less clamping pressure that the Factory specifies which means there is a better chance of the lug nut loosening. That is never a good thing.....

Slakker

Excellent article! Saving to my permanent file.

The rotors did look like they were stamped with ink. So it could be temperature ratings on the pads or lack of bedding (they were bedded per instructions but not bedded beyond that. )

This will either clear up some discussions I've seen or bedding techniques, or re-ignite, not sure which.

mark kibort

all the pads at this level will be fine. (OEM min,and some performance rated pad.)the "better" pads just work at the higher temps.. this just means if you get them really hot, they still work.. stock OEM pads may not, and thats the concern here. they stocp working, you push harder, it creates more heat and then the fluid boils. the nasty stock pad cycle. Yellows are fine. oranges work too, if you are staying in the pagid family. blacks i found to be great and had a lot of street miles on them.. BUT, being harder to bed, makes them unpopular choice with street/track cars. (squeeling is the problem if not bedded perfectly because they are harder and grippier)

Matt, dont be such a dxxk!!! please. my suggestion was 90ft-lbs... its what i use. sure the spec is 94.8. 5% either way is not going to change anything or make it more risky. there is a LOT of safety margin built in to street specs . the main reason for the spec, is that torque has to survive, vibration ,and 1000s of heat cycles, in addition to the torque to hold the wheel on the hub. i wasnt refereing to trucks and other cars. 5 bolt lug specs ranges was what i was refering too.
so, listening to me and tighting your lugs at 90ft-lbs is going to get you "hurt". really? ok Chicken Little.

I agree with all your torque specs. that is not the issue . what is the issue is wheel damage and rotor warping . i use 90ft-lbs because its a nice round number. its still practically at spec. 5% of torque values is MORE than acceptable. Personally, i had a big problem with new studs even with some antiseize going through major heat cycles at the track and gettting stuck! could have been interaction with the kenesis wheel ... I dont know.. anyway, no problems these days as the wheels and steel lugs, and studs are very friendly .
the ONLY reason i go slightly less on torquing , is my own thoughts on the wear patterns of the studs or nuts AND one major factor of the spec,...... so they dont come off over time.. because we change tires every session, in 20mins, 90ftlbs vs 95ftlbs is not going to change the world or endanger your life , (MATT). Its just easier , strength-wise doing it all by hand. im calibrated to +/- 5 ft-lbs by hand at the track.

NYC993

to throw a wrinkle...porsche uses alum lug nuts on some cars while most of us use steel ones for the track. Does that change torques spec? Idk

Also, not mentioned, make sure the lug nuts are tightened while wheel is in the air and do it in a star pattern. Don't tighten one lug all the way but distribute the torque.

Start threading by hand so you dont crossthread them.

Be careful using impact guns for reasons above. And let wheels cool off a bit before taking them off right away.

winders

Not only does he know more than everyone else about everything, he is a human torque wrench!

TXE36

I'm sure the car really benefits from nice round lug nut torque numbers .

• 9 year old tires - check
• Cracked rotors - check
• Undertorqued lug nuts - well maybe, don't know because no torque wrench

-Mike