jenk12m

im sure if i wasnt being lazy i could find around here how all the classes go with all the race groups i.e pca, nasa, pboc, etc.

so i was wondering where would a 996 gtb1 car with a 3.6L be placed with other groups. mainly nasa and pboc? i believe max weight is 3100 with driver whereas with 3.4L its 2800 or 2900lbs. looking for a little clarification. thanks

KJinDC

In NASA, GTS-3. The BMWs in GTS-3 are so well developed, it's tough for P-Cars. That said, Ryan did a 2:05 or so at VIR in an H 997 which should in theory be a little slower than a GTB-1 car so maybe he found the secret mojo. I haven't raced with NASA in a few years but the times I keep hearing from the GTS-3 guys i know keep getting faster and faster. I know my car (partially due to the driver) wouldn't be competit-ve in GTS-3.

I don't know much about the other clubs.

-KJ

jenk12m

i have a bimmer that's a possibility but it would be GTS-4 or 5 car. not many bimmer shops around me to help with the car though

mglobe

It really depends upon the local competition how competitive a GTB or SP996 car will be in GTS3. The issue is that so much is allowed in GTS that is not allowed in the PCA classes that it's difficult to compete if you are up against someone with a big budget and a very good and creative race shop. In Texas an SP996 or GTB1 car can podium in GTS3. But when you get to the national level you have no chance.

KaiB

Why not build a GTS4 / GT4 car out of a 996?

I do believe this has been done in a track record / Nat champ way.

Veloce Raptor

This is, I think, the salient point here.

And yes, Ryan M is very fast in his H-classed 997...but that car has all sorts of goodies that makes its classification in H quite...optimistic...but technically legal Now, put a proper GTB-style Cup wing on that thing, and he would kick some serious BMW ***...

jenk12m

I could only imagine Ryan's car with a cup wing, but that one piece would take him out of H for sure. I have a bimmer waiting for me that would be a blast to drive but my heart is keeping me with porsche

paradisenb

Crossing over between organizations is not all that easy. NASA is pretty much an arms race because all that matters is weight/HP. Everything else appears to be free. One very positive thing is they have 5 events at Rd Atl this year.

Limits are one good thing about PCA Stock classes. A lot is allowed, but there are reasonable (mostly) limits. GT classes are arms races.

Don't know much about PBOC, but they seem run most of their events at Sebring and a few at Barber. Sebring is too long a haul to make frequently IMO.

Izzone

Ryan's car is cup car money...997 cup

Him and I had fun at vir though. There where's few gtb cars that were a hassle to get by..slicks > r6

jenk12m

randy, sebring is not a bad tow from our area. almost the same trip north to mid ohio.

within every class besides the true spec boc n 996 its seems like an arms race. ive seen caymans in gtb that are totally different speeds on the straights and heard complaints about it too.

it just seems from looking up results in the southeast from races, gtb and gts3 have decent fields even if they are filled with caymans.

Izzone

Gt4s is a pretty fun class

I've got to stuff a bit more tire and bolt a few more hp on and the antique should take a few track records

Veloce Raptor

PBOC runs at Sebring, Road Atlanta, Barber, Homestead, and now NOLA.

Yes, I agree, Micheal, even the letter classes in PCA have become partial arms races, now that full remote reservior dampers are legal, etc. Many of the D and E and G and H cars (including Ryan's) are prime examples.

Izzone

Isn't all racing an arms race?

Tech is only so good, and technology / money have made spec cars faster than theoretical hp

There are some cars I have raced against north of 400 hp in a 3.0L

mglobe

Even if a car isn't competitive with the very front of the pack, having more than one organization that you can race with is really nice. In my neck of the woods, running with PCA and NASA more than doubles the number of races I have available to me within an 8-hour tow (full disclosure, I run a Miata with NASA, but I could run the 996). You don't have to be racing for the win to be having fun in a race, and fun is what we do this for isn't it?

rmag

Crossing between organizations is tough. You really need to pick the group, then the class you want to run with, and build/buy a competitive car for that. Then if you want to run with another organization, just be prepared to be mid pack. While I ran a 2:05 at VIR, running as a GTS3 car in NASA I would be run over. I know Josh Smith sold his National Champ GTS3 car last year. He was testing it with new owner and turned a 2:01 at VIR

Partial is the key word here for the letter classes. To build a competitive car to the limit of the rules it is expensive, but also contained. Once done, there is nothing left to do, unlike GTs where you can always find something more to spend money on. No matter what stock letter class you pick, the cost of parts and build is almost the same. Only real difference is cost of the car you start with.

GTB1 is now a huge class. Caymans seem to be dominating over the 996s now (with the PDKs even furthering the gap.)


Thanks. Car was built to guidelines within the stock rules. No grey areas at all. Just did almost everything allowable. Still a heavy car with only a 3.6. I ran a 993 in H for a year and got run over. Dog of the class. While I could out corner and brake a lot of people, I'd get crushed on the straights. I lost over 1.5 seconds on the back straight of sebring to the 996s. Now I can pull them by a 1-2 car lengths