2014 GT3
03-05-2013, 09:05 AM
#16
The Penguin King
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03-05-2013, 09:26 AM
#18
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True. Cayman R is a great car IMO!
Ha! Well...I am so why hide from the facts?
But to me, experience is a good thing, whereas breathlessly & smugly proclaiming "but but but THE FUTURE" is not.
But to each his own...
And Pete is correct, especially rear wheel steering and the ultra-crap faux centerlocks. UGH.
Ha! Well...I am so why hide from the facts?
But to me, experience is a good thing, whereas breathlessly & smugly proclaiming "but but but THE FUTURE" is not.But to each his own...
And Pete is correct, especially rear wheel steering and the ultra-crap faux centerlocks. UGH.
03-05-2013, 09:28 AM
#19
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03-05-2013, 09:32 AM
#20
Three Wheelin'
There are continuous advances made in the sport of auto racing; not all of them stick. We call those fads. I'm not saying the PDK is a fad but it does remove the skill of shifting a car while doing everything else it is you have to do and thus removes any kind of talent one might have for doing it better/smoother than someone else. So, while you morph into something from the movie Wall-E I'll continue to work on mastering something other than turning into a mindless blob.
03-05-2013, 09:48 AM
#21
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I really, really don't want to get into a pissing contest over PDK, but I would like to comment. I am a PCA Club Racer, and I drive a 944 S2 which, we'd all agree, requires significant driver participation in order to be even vaguely quick. Having said those things, I've owned a 997 Turbo with PDK for a little over a year now. I don't track it, but I gotta say I love driving it, and it is a fantastic piece of technology. My sense is that Porsche is out to produce the quickest possible street-legal race car, and if the words "quickest possible" are in the equation, then PDK it is. I might also add one other thing- the ability to have both hands on the wheel at both times is a significant factor in going faster. Finally, and I think that this is what really bothers "purists" the most, as cool (and quick) as it is to paddle shift the car, there is much empirical and anecdotal evidence to suggest that the fastest way around the race track with PDK is to put it in D and go. Prior to buying the car, I talked to Hurley Haywood at the Daytona Club Race about it. He told me that a person of reasonable ability would always be faster in a PDK car than a 7-speed manual, and further said that on the race track, the PDK would always, always be in the correct gear. My two cents, YMMV. Peace.
03-05-2013, 10:24 AM
#23
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I really, really don't want to get into a pissing contest over PDK, but I would like to comment. I am a PCA Club Racer, and I drive a 944 S2 which, we'd all agree, requires significant driver participation in order to be even vaguely quick. Having said those things, I've owned a 997 Turbo with PDK for a little over a year now. I don't track it, but I gotta say I love driving it, and it is a fantastic piece of technology. My sense is that Porsche is out to produce the quickest possible street-legal race car, and if the words "quickest possible" are in the equation, then PDK it is. I might also add one other thing- the ability to have both hands on the wheel at both times is a significant factor in going faster. Finally, and I think that this is what really bothers "purists" the most, as cool (and quick) as it is to paddle shift the car, there is much empirical and anecdotal evidence to suggest that the fastest way around the race track with PDK is to put it in D and go. Prior to buying the car, I talked to Hurley Haywood at the Daytona Club Race about it. He told me that a person of reasonable ability would always be faster in a PDK car than a 7-speed manual, and further said that on the race track, the PDK would always, always be in the correct gear. My two cents, YMMV. Peace.
03-05-2013, 10:29 AM
#24
The Penguin King
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03-05-2013, 10:32 AM
#25
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03-05-2013, 10:45 AM
#26
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No argument that PDK is an advancement in technology. But...to ME, part of driving is the involvement of the drive, not just the speed or how quick the shifts are. PDK completely takes that away.
Sure it's faster shifting, but until someone is paying me to win at LeMans (or anywhere for that matter), I'll take the driver involvement of a manual. I drive for the fun and enjoyment of the experience and don't care about the fast shifting.
While I understand that from a technology standpoint PDK is a manual transmission, from an experience standpoint, it's an automatic.
Sure it's faster shifting, but until someone is paying me to win at LeMans (or anywhere for that matter), I'll take the driver involvement of a manual. I drive for the fun and enjoyment of the experience and don't care about the fast shifting.
While I understand that from a technology standpoint PDK is a manual transmission, from an experience standpoint, it's an automatic.
With all the bickering over the past years about whether PDK is God or the devil, I think you summed it up nicely.
I've driven PDK on the track and it is quick. Fast smooth manual up and downshifts are part of the challenge to me and I suspect always will be. I enjoy it. That being said, if I were buying a street car I might consider PDK!
03-05-2013, 10:56 AM
#28
The Penguin King
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03-05-2013, 10:57 AM
#29
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Meh. When everyone has flappy paddles, and everyone can shift super fast with zero skill needed, where is the advantage? I know from racing that the driver who is really good at shifting up and especially down a manual transmission has a time advantage on track over one who doesn't, all other things being equal. It was a big differentiator. But when everyone has a sequential like in a 997 Cup, the advantages are narrowed to he/she who is better with the clutch timing and better with the blip timing. When everyone has auto blip, it comes down to clutch. And when everyoone has flappy PDK paddles that requires no clutch...what's the point?
03-05-2013, 11:13 AM
#30
Three Wheelin'
Gonna stray off topic rather quickly...
I used to be against PDK or any sequential shift gearbox for a street car. But, after driving a Carrera GT and having to baby the thing to get it off the line and letting the electronics do its thing to get it going and driving an Audi R8 GT with it's auto/manual sequential box I prefer the auto for a street car. It just makes getting along with everyday things so much easier.
BUT...for a track car, it's all manual/all the time. Which brings the question, who buys a brand new GT3 for a track car? Typically it's the person that's only been in the game for a relatively short amount of time and wants to go faster and thinks that the tool will get him there. Let's be real here, how many 997 GT3/RS do you see club racing week in and week out? Usually 0, but maybe 1 or 2. It's a cheaper buy in to get a used Cup car than it is to get a street GT3 once you factor safety and go fast stuff into it and most of the time people that do track their street GT3 end up going 'down' to an older air cooled car and go just as fast as they did in the street GT3.
Just my thoughts, take them or leave them. I'm not as old as VR, but I sure think he's funny how someone with 25 posts on here called him out thinking they were the chosen one.
I used to be against PDK or any sequential shift gearbox for a street car. But, after driving a Carrera GT and having to baby the thing to get it off the line and letting the electronics do its thing to get it going and driving an Audi R8 GT with it's auto/manual sequential box I prefer the auto for a street car. It just makes getting along with everyday things so much easier.
BUT...for a track car, it's all manual/all the time. Which brings the question, who buys a brand new GT3 for a track car? Typically it's the person that's only been in the game for a relatively short amount of time and wants to go faster and thinks that the tool will get him there. Let's be real here, how many 997 GT3/RS do you see club racing week in and week out? Usually 0, but maybe 1 or 2. It's a cheaper buy in to get a used Cup car than it is to get a street GT3 once you factor safety and go fast stuff into it and most of the time people that do track their street GT3 end up going 'down' to an older air cooled car and go just as fast as they did in the street GT3.
Just my thoughts, take them or leave them. I'm not as old as VR, but I sure think he's funny how someone with 25 posts on here called him out thinking they were the chosen one.