certz

I am not sure how other regions and organizations handle habitual poor driving, but a few years ago a guy wrecked two cars at back-to-back events and was asked to take an extended hiatus. He still came to the track occassionally but did not drive for over a year at any of the regions events. I have also witnessed an instructor, after several sessions, tell their student they felt they did not belong on the track, would no longer instruct them and that if they wished to continue driving they should speak with the chief driving instructor. It can be difficult to make calls like these at times, but sometimes, in my opinion, a little tough love is warranted especially if a driver is endangering themselves or others.

At one event, my wife was given a talking too for being overly aggressive. That night we were discussing it, and as I had ridden a session with her and made basically the same remarks, I agreed with the comments. All I know is the guest room is cold and dark and makes funny noises.

mglobe

Finally something of value in this thread!

multi21

BMWCCA Pacific Region does this. They have student and instructor evaluations for each DE with a copy going to the student and the results in a database. Once a person signs up for a DE with CCA Pacific Region, their name is put in the system and both comments from the instructor, who the instructor was and what their recommendation for the next driving group/level is established.

Matt Romanowski

^^NCR PCA does this as well. Done it for years.

mglobe

Same with LSR. The CDI can look up evaluations of every student. I would wager that most PCA programs do this.

We follow their development, and try to do the best we can to bring them along. Furthermore, when you are assigned a student, you can look up the previous instructors' comments so that you are best prepared for the weekend.

Mahler9th

There can be challenging social problems. DE is one thing. Racing is another. I have seen quite a few racers "self-select" themselves out over the years. I have also seen others struggle.

One example was a fellow that was racing quite a bit and mixed in some DE's. He did a PCA event a few years ago, and forgot the passing rules on the first lap. He went to pass a car without a point by, and the result was modest car-to-car contact. The other car was driven by a local instructor who also happened to be a national PCA management team leader carrying a student. Very little damage to the guy's GT3 cup, but about $2-5k of damage to the instructor's car. I do not think the instructor got much, if anything in compensation. It was very awkward.

I wonder how people would react to my 2002 video at Buttonwillow which shows my steering wheel coming off on the out lap because the quick release was not fully engaged. PCA DE. Very thrilling experience. Later that weekend my wife got TTOD. I am not sure that ever happened before or since at a PCA event with a timed portion.

Anyway, I try not to jump to any conclusions when I watch internet videos unless/until I have all of the info or can see a clear and consistent pattern.

Mahler9th

Deleted. Switch bounce

aft911

Yep. I think another thing that helps the cause with LSR (Hill Country and Maverick, as well) is that multiple people are involved in the promotion decision. So it helps maintain the on-paper standards. Any process run by humans will be less than 100% perfect, but I think it runs pretty darn well in these 3 regions (I speak only to these because they are the only ones I've had direct involvement as an instructor, I hear great things about many other regions).

russo

Likewise. I was hoping to be there this weekend but the weather doesn't appear to be receptive.

333pg333

Video is down. I guess that might be the 'legal' part of the thread earlier.

jbossolo

Good. Time to let it die.

DJF1

Its up again:
https://rennlist.com/forums/rennlist...n-youtube.html

I read your previous posts and I'm not sure I get you logic here. Damn right the people that let him out alone on the track armed with a GT2 should get ejected from the track or organize anything in my book. "Oh no lets throw this under the rug" attitude is not cool IMO.
I dont have any stake in this, but damn it is completely unacceptable for someone like him to be given a solo clearance. It may be an individual's decision which led to this mistake, never the less people are lucky that noone got hurt.

I hope that this organization learns from this experience and the evident outcry. We will all be safer at a DE in the long run.

jbossolo

Corrective action has been taken by his region. Let it rest.

jrgordonsenior

Just another understeering GT2 with street tires. I drove a properly setup one (by GMG) and it was a very well balanced beast....

Mikelly

Good example of to much car for the driver. There are instructors here who will remember my miserable experiences the first year I had my black 996TT. The car was far more car than I could ever imagine and the first year was very "memorable" for myself and at least two different instructors.

Best thing I could ever have done was slow down, turn the ego back to 5 and START LISTENING to people who were wanting to HELP me. Next best thing I did was build a specmiata. Having to LEARN to drive a lower powered car with ZERO electronic nannys really put the emphasis back on the driver.

Since becoming an instructor I've had atleast one student, a pretty good friend of mine actually, who scared me during an event. I got out of the second day because I'd been double booked for the second day and had to pass him off to the chief steward, but NOT before having a talk with the steward infront of the student in question about my concerns.

My opions on the video and the blame game are simple. Some GUY spends his money and has every right to be on track, until he is unsafe. The video clips clearly show he is unsafe, regardless of the opinions of his friends. The driving coach should have spoken with the folks running the event and expressed the exact level of concern and how much dialogue had transpired, to include the chat infront of the wife and the intent of that ploy.

None of us want to hear that we aren't "getting it" and maybe we should consider golf or something else. For some of us it's a matter of learning, changing platforms, having your priorities in order, and most importantly of all, having it click that DE IS A TEAM SPORT in every single rungroup. It's not about ME, it's about WE. Without that understanding, this particular guy will continue with his bad habits until someone is hurt or worse. THAT is total failure for everyone involved.