TheOtherEric

Ask him if he got a favorable settlement with Hans last year. He probably won't give you details, but by the words & tone of his response, you may get an idea if he's really allowed on the market under the settlement. I think he needs to understand that most of his market is sitting back waiting to see if Hans sues him and his product disappears again. They REALLY need to address this.

Martin S.

I tried the ISSAC for a while. My Club Race group specifies FIA certified....the ISSAC was not at the time, so I sold the ISSAC to a Rennlister and bought the latest HANS model with the slots for the 3" to 2" to 3" shoulder belts.

The ISSAC web site was/is very informative. Lots of info on side impact data. On paper the ISSAC clearly looks superior. Could be that ISSAC is now FIA certified.

Circuit Motorsports

I am pretty sure that Hans was not the group that sued them. I believe it was the Leatt company (their former employer) who got them stopped. Pretty sure I read that over on vette forum in a post from one of the guys at Hans.

I am in the same boat for the hurry up and wait right now. I'll check it out but give it a while before I talk with some insiders about what might happen.

winders

Well, do you have any numbers yourself or is all your are doing expressing personal opinion based on other people's data? Do you have your own test sleds and measuring equipment? If you are going to discount what people have to say because they don't have their own test data in every sentence, then we all might as well shut up.

Based on the numbers I have seen posted and they get interpreted, it would seem we should all chuck our Hans Devices in the trash. The reality is that the Hans Device does work and does exactly what it was designed to do.

At our level, picking a head and neck system based on comfort is not a mistake.

Scott

TheOtherEric

Hans did sue them, as did Leatt. Here's what court filings say:

JUN 2008 - IST (Innovative Safety Technology) forms in U.S. to make and sell the DefNder. Kevin Heath will import (from China) and distribute it, and is alleged to be part owner. link

LATE 2008 - Leatt pursues IST in S. Africa for misappropriating its trade secrets, and wins a judgment.

APR 2009 - Hans sues IST for patent infringement due to DefNder.

JUN 2009 - Leatt sues IST in U.S. to enforce S. African award and to stop them from making/selling DefNder in U.S.

APR 2010 - Hans sues Kevin Heath for patent infringement due to importing the DefNder.

AUG 2010 - IST seems to disappear, so court enters default judgment in favor of Hans, thus prohibiting IST from selling DefNder.

SEP 2010 - Leatt wins default judgment against IST, which prohibits IST from selling DefNder. link

AUG 2011 - Hans and Kevin Heath reach a settlement, and the patent infringement case is dismissed.

2012 - NecksGen to sell a product similar to (or same as) DefNder. Same address as Kevin Heath, so it's presumably his company.

Seeing as how the DefNder can no longer be sold in the U.S., it seems questionable if Necksgen will be allowed. I would assume Hans and Leatt will be suing them any day now, to enforce the existing judgments against the DefNder product.

kurt M

Screw sled data. Dummies on metal park benches or humans in real world conditions? At this point there are years of real world data out there. BSF in wrecks with H&N systems in use? Any real world numbers? Anyone talking? Anyone have info on any brand H&N system failures?

bonehead

So, it IS public record. Thanks for the info, Eric. It is a shame that HANS is suppressing the competition/innovation. But as I said before, don't think anyone wants a product from a (soon-to-be?) defunct company and thus have no aftermarket support.

winders

Really? If you had a patent that made you money, would you not protect it? All HANS is doing is preventing competitors from copying, not competing or innovating.

Scott

bonehead

Not sure why you seem to be jumping down everyone's throat on this matter. Do you have a personal stake in HANS?
I understand the 'why'. That's perfectly obvious. All I said was it was a shame they were doing so.

winders

I have no clowns in this circus. Do you have your own business? Have you every sold a product that you own the patent on? You are legally required to protect that patent or you risk losing the patent.

It seems you want HANS to give away their intellectual property so others can build a competing product without spending the money and time on research and development. Maybe even put them out of business. That makes no sense at all!

Scott

bonehead

Ummm.....okay. Obviously a touchy subject for you. As a matter of fact, I do have my own business. I don't have any forthcoming patents, but if I did, you're damn right I would do anything to protect my ability to reap the benefits of my innovation.
But seeing as I don't have any 'clowns in this circus' either, I don't care a whiff if HANS loses its ability to stifle the competition. All I care about is getting the best product around my neck.
Double-edged sword? Yes. So, sue me.

f1rocks

Can't wait for the patent to run out so the prices get competitive.....

I'm tired of paying $575 for an injected molded plastic part that could be a third the cost and still be very profitable for them.

Carrera51

We have the NeckGen devices arriving early next week according to tracking numbers. I am interested to see how much it differs from the DefNder.

winders

Touchy? Not really. You just don't make any sense. You want someone, as long as it is not you, to give away their intellectual property so you can benefit. I think that says it all....

Scott

winders

I would like these devices to be cheaper too. But how many times have you bought one?

I suspect the one Hans Device I bought last year will be last such device I buy. So I probably will never benefit from such a price reduction if it takes place.

Scott