BC

It seems as though the gist of the the lemons-type of rules on car-entry is that the value of the car must end up being 500 or less, sans any safety items.

So I have a 2000 dollar car, but I sold the engine for 1000, and the transmission for 1250. That means the car where it stands is -250 right?

I already had the engine and trans from the other parts of other cars. The engine can be put together from many used parts for very little, and the transmission IS rebuilt, but was bought for very little.

Is this normally how the math is done and is this acceptable?

I don't want to skirt the rules in any way, but I also don't want to be so far on one side of the scale that I am singled out.

ubercooper

When in doubt, talk to Nick Pon at Lemons HQ... he's helped me out with numerous questions

510.655.5980 X22

DAVISRILEY

LeMons and ChumpCar differ on this. In LeMons, that car would be at a net zero, and you would be allowed to spend up to $500 on the car, not including brakes, tires, safety, etc. In ChumpCar, you have to do an AIV(Average internet value). You have to come up with a bunch of craigslist, ebay, autotrader ads to back up the fact that the car is roughly a $500 car.

Now, that being said, it is open to interpretation. Be prepared that if you show up in an BMW, P-car, etc you will get sweated in bs inspection in LeMons. Now if you you show up in a Citroen DS or something like that, it almost irrelevent how much you spend. Ymmv.

certz

Documentation and consistent "story." Have receipts, printout the KBB value page (or where ever you came up with that $2,000 value), document everything and then come up with a story that you and the rest of your have memorized and will stick to. Lemons is not worried about a few bucks here and there, but if this engine and transmission you had "lying around" is some souped-up Cosworth V8 then you will not be able to explain how the car is only worth $500.

IMO, they are "appraising" whether you have followed the spirit of the $500 rule more than if you really spent only $500. That and they love a good story. Oh, and a good bribe.

BC

Thanks for the great comments.

Documentation. Hmmm. Well, I have the original emails of the 2000 purchase and subsequent shipping of the car to me from South carolina. I have the emails of the sale of the drivetrain.

The engine is yet to be built but is completely "spare parts" in nature.

The transmission will be more difficult. Also, the car has no dents, scratches, or broken.... anything.

With Chumpcar's AIV, is that still going to be adjusted like AIG in your taxes - meaning if I show the sold parts will that reduce the AIV?


Its a Porsche 928"S3". An 86.5. Quite rare, actually. But it has had an accident that was fixed very well previously. It has a kink in the back frame behind the shock tower, so it matters to no one but me because I scrubbed the car to a spit shine underneath in preparing it for a very different use before I found the accident damage.

I either go this way or I use a different 928 that I bought for 1500 and use the same scheme. That one is a straight body but has a dented fender. It has a great story as well. All true, only the names have been changed.


I was born and raise in Chicago (now in SoCal) - the bribe is something I am very familiar with. The Chicago way.

DAVISRILEY

No, chumpcar doesn't care what you sell off, they only care what the aiv is. Before I would commit to building do some searching, see if you can find a bunch of craigslist ads for an 86 928. See what you come up with, that's what they use for aiv. Good luck, that should be a neat car. I always liked how the 928 felt smaller and smaller the harder you pushed it.

Steamboat

One of the series has a rule that if the "judges" pin the value over $500 they can "buy" the car from you for that amount if they think you've been too egregious with the rules. They give you 30 minutes to remove whatever equipment you can salvage and then you're screwed. Never heard of that actually happening but its been in some set of rules. Perhaps it's changed in the last year but it's worth looking into and understanding......best

Oh, yeah, there's also the the rule where if your fellow competitors think you've gone bull$hit, they get to vote to have your car crushed. Never heard of that actually happening either but it's in the rules too. Some of this is a bit draconian but it gets the point across......best again.

d15b7

hi. I would be amazed if you could find a mostly clean, rust free good running 928 of any year for less than $500 in the 'real world'. by that, I mean, you will probably get assessed 500 penalty laps in Chumps just to start off with. Lemons -- you'll have competitors pouring all over your car like maple syrup and complaining. there was a car torn apart with a backhoe at CMP a long time back at Lemons; they voted it with the 'curse' and it was destroyed. idk if that is still done, but i'd worry about it showing up with a good clean running 928 at Lemons event. now, if i were really serious about building a good running 928 for lemons or chumps, and i wanted it to skate thru tech, i think i'd (seriously) drive it thru the woods and bang up every single panel; mangle it up and make it look like a complete heap of sh$%; maybe even burn it a little or something and come up with a story. showing up with a very clean looking, good running 928 that is bound to literally scream away from most of the fiat x1/9s and toyota corollas and mazda 323s that are in the field is begging for (unwanted) scrutiny. good luck and have fun!

IcemanG17

BTDT

you will need a reasonable value assigned to the new drivetrain.........I sold a 4.5L 928 v8 for $250 and bought the one in the estate for $300......

the easiest answer for you.........just buy mine.........ready to race & well know to the judges

txhokie4life

Listen to IcemanG17 and save yourself 500 hours of labor!!!!

dizzyj

hmmm..a line on a sub 500 928. Mike, think we could AIV that? :P

BC

That's ridiculous. And unfortunate. The CAR is supposed to be 500 - but the safety equipment and brakes are not. Why would you sell a 500 dollar car with a 1000 of safety and brakes for 500? Why would you even risk the car for crushing if it was 505 or 600?

I don't wish to skirt the rules. If I can subtract like I explained, then great - but if not I would not attempt entry with this car.

BC

Well, I appreciate that info. Craigslist will only prove I am bringing a 6000 dollar car. I got a great deal because of an iffy title (I fixed it) and the incomplete nature of the car (some assembly required - interior, etc). So that's maybe not going to help.

BC

This seems to be a trend of info, and I appreciate it. This car may just be too clean - and I would truly hate to first of all cause any off-track drama, but also not be able to continue. I have the 1500 dollar 85 that has some rips in the fenders, etc. But I could still sell that for about 4k - as is.

But no - there really are no 500 dollar 86.5 928s in the wild - unless they are twisted.

BC

Hey Brian. I can't buy any more cars like you can't. No
More room or good will with the wife. I have these in the collection, so it's worth it to find out. But I think I have and I don't want to risk even a dollar being turned into garbage because of someone's perspective on value
Or a rule sheet. It sounds like fun racing, but I won't/can't risk my efforts and money in that way.