mark kibort

besides the wrenchng on the wheel and the shufflesteering, didnt it look like to you that he induced that oversteer by sterring input? I mean, there have been a lot of speed touring cars with no aero that I would bet are running faster than this car. But, If you lost a wing, and count on that downforce in the rear, the surprise alone could surely be a bad thing.

Funny, you found the speed of a Riley car at that point.

cgomez

Unless he had 600hp+. I dont lift at all coming out of 5A through all that section in my 997 GT2 (530hp and better aero than a Scuby) and I'm only up to 135mph at the point where he spins.

Darren

Eh -- I don't know, just posting what I saw. I think the car makes close to 600 awhp and he has been running time attack/time trial events in pretty much the same package for a couple of years now.

His time last year at VIR was 1:59.2 in a Time Trial -- I don't know what class (its a lot heavier than a Cup Car for example).

Anyway the point of posting that was that we're talking about how important the aero is and I threw that out there that he is claiming that this wreck was caused by a broken rear wing. Personally, if my wing broke I think I'd lift and slow down before turning in.

Darren

He made 2 huge jerks to the left, the second of which ended badly. I think 99.9% of us don't jerk the wheel like that turning in. Maybe the car tolerated it with the wing and didn't without.

333pg333

"2 huge jerks"?? I hardly think what he did nearly approached that description. Looked more like some small helpless reactions to what was going to always unfold. Not a pleasant result and to the point of the topic, shows how aero can definitely have some effect.

bobt993

Patrick at well over 100mph the wheel inputs were a lot. He has been running Time Trials for a long time and been very fast with no offs. He is also fast in the rain so I think equipment failure played a huge role in the event. Anyone running under 2mins a lap at VIR is fast.

Darren

Seems rough to me at 140!! But what do I know, it is the Internet so flame away.

I think he'd be correcting in the opposite direction though -- he wasn't correcting, he was turning in.

kurt M

I was not there and don't know the car but it almost looks like he dropped the drivers side wheels off the pavement with the wheel slightly turned in the and the back stepped out. I think that might have started the spin. Not having a real working wing in that area of the track would cause a handling change.

Hard sideways hit. Looks like his bell was ringing for a few seconds before he started to exit the car. Glad he was able to walk way with as little damage as he sustained. I might guess that the same impact in a car without a cage, seat and the driver using H&N might not have the same outcome.

Veloce Raptor

IMO, he was also sitting WAY too far back from the steering wheel. However, 1:59 at VIR is mighty quick. I really liked his line 2-3. he is one of the few folks I have seen (in video) to do it the fast way: as one big arc, not two separate turns.









Professional Racing and Driving Coach

SundayDriver

But he shuffle-steered. That must be the cause of the crash, not the failed wing.

Seriously, I agree he sits to far back. That forces shuffle-steering (said by someone who often does small shuffles as I like my hands level (3 & 9) in the corner. I also wonder if there are some suspension issues with that car (bump steer?) that the steering wheel has odd direction at times.

Fritz Flynn

In my RX7 2800lbs w/ driver I'm also at 135 making 335 rwhp. His car is making about 500 rwhp and weighs the same. He's quick through 5a and I'm sure he's reaching those speeds (he ran a 1.59 in the time trial the last time I was on track with him). I won't comment on his steering, driving, aero or anything else as I have way too much respect for anyone who builds and drives their own car running sub 2s at VIR in a subaru no less.

gums

My first thought too was that he was sitting way far back, but there's some camera effect to that, and his position looks very comfortable and relaxed. In any case, and for whatever reason, that's a HELL of a hit, scares the s***t out of me. Broke the steering wheel, for Christ sake!

Veloce Raptor

He looks comfortable & relaxed, but his arms look pretty much fully extended. IMO it is very tough to catch a car when you're steering with your shoulders. Agree 100% about the hit. Nasty....









Professional Racing and Driving Coach

333pg333

Firstly I think that the two small inputs he makes are mostly a reaction to the bumps in the track. I also agree that a wheel went off the track (probably due to the wing coming off?) and this was the end of his day. He does look a little stretched from the wheel but also the wide angle lens adds to this appearance. I don't believe there was any correction that was going to save him imho.

mark kibort

I saw that too,and certainly , after a long day and many times through that corner at the same speeds, if what ever was working, suddenly stops working, I could see how this can happen. I had a simlar step out, (unexpected) due to a low tire, that I was able to correct, but it was much easier to do this through a carocel, and a much lower speed. This one in the video happened so fast, he was without hope in saving it. I dont think the shuffle sterring, or moving the hands had anything to do with it, and obviously, he runs a quick lap time, if he ran 1:59, but the abruptness through a very high speed turn is what was surprising to me. Watch someone really good through the kink at a track near you and see if they put down that kind of preturn input.
Again, no doubt the wing falling off and unbalancing the car had a lot to do with it. Point is, could that car go through that turn without the wing at that speed, with proper care and inputs? Possibly.