tkerrmd

that is correct. like me spending a day as a med student in a family practice office vs being at a busy ER. things happen faster and you need to know how to react faster to more situations

Weston

Yes and no. There's certainly no guarantee that a racer will be a better driver than a DE guy, but there's far more motivation and opportunity to become better when in a race environment, so most racers tend to be. I've never seen a new racer come from DE, or even Time Trials, and run a top qualifying time right off the bat. I've been told countless times how some new driver is going to be fast and whatnot, but I've only seen a few who showed real promise, and it still took them time to get up to speed with the rest of us.

Realistically, in a DE or similar group, you're just trying to learn to drive the line and to drive it fast. Go wheel-to-wheel racing in a large competitive class and you'll find that you need a heck of a lot more than that. There's a huge difference between driving around at your own pace by yourself or doing a lead-follow, and wheel-to-wheel racing. In racing, there are no cool-down laps, no maintaining a safe distance, no pulling into the pits any time you think you have a mechanical issue, etc. You're out there for 30-45 minutes, running at full blast the whole time. If you don't drive 10/10ths, consistently, or know how to be fast while driving off line, you get passed. If you aren't eager to drive side-by-side through the turns, right on someone's bumper, or off the line (sometimes in the dirt), you're handing an advantage to your competitors. It can be very intense, exhausting, ballsy, and full of strategy.

Some drivers who came from DE pick this stuff up and do well, while others really just belong in DE. Either way, there's a new skill set that new racers have to learn in order to do well. Knowing how to drive fast on the race line is great for qualifying, but that alone is not going to cut it in a real race. When circumstances put me behind a relatively new racer, the #1 way I get around them is to get them out of their comfort zone, and all it usually takes is to get right up in their mirrors or get them to drive off of the race line. Some eventually adapt and get much better at race craft, which makes them a lot harder to pass, even if they're running slower laps.

RickBetterley

Presumably racers are (almost) all from the advanced DE run groups, so on average I suppose they are better.
Are they better on average than the average advanced DE driver? I would think so, since they have to deal with a lot of issues that those of us in DE don't face. Not dealing with them effectively adds a heavier dose of Darwin than DE, I suppose.
Silly post, but I am guessing its tongue in cheek (or else Doc is up to his old tricks and it's serious).

multi21

The DE instructor ranks are swelling from "racers" due to the economy because they can't afford to race anymore.

multi21

In All this BS, Paolo, DDS is laughing at us while he races

RSRRacer

The "racer" skill level and "DE" skill level bell curves overlap with the best 30% of DErs being better, more skilled, etc than the worst 30% of racers.

The De skillset bell curve will not have much of a tail on the higher skillset end, whereas the racer one will have a longer tail since there are a handful of racers than simply make the rest of us look silly.

You can argue about the overlap percentage (15-50%) but not much about the fundamental shape of the bell curves.

And, the racers still in the overlap section, you know who you are, and you can't talk s--T to the DErs yet!

Larry Herman

Here's my take FWIW.

1) Racers have the opportunity to develop a greater variety of driving skills due to the racing environment (which has been described in previous posts here). They are in a situation where they have to drive under pressure, and learn how to cope with that pressure. That may not always make them better drivers, but it does make them better racers.

2) DEs allow for more opportunity (if fully utilized) to expand ones knowledge of pure driving and there are certainly a number of DE guys who have the skills to drive quite fast laps. However, driving fast laps is only one component of racing and so there are certainly skills that they have not developed as compared to racers.

One other point, isn't the mantra that you should not be driving 10/10s at a DE, and so how do you continue to get better at driving if once you've mastered 9/10s you can't strive for 10/10s?

ajcjr

What i do not understand is why a DE line differs from a racing line. You would think a racer would want the quickest line possible around the track, yet when you watch the DE session they seem to take a different line around the track.

I hope to be a DE guy who is fast and kicks @ss when he races.

M758

Speaking in general terms - Yes

A DE driver needs to only drive on the track. A racer needs to drive on the and think about passing/not being passed. This takes more skill and effort than just driving.

However there are some guys in DE that are better drivers than those in race cars. The level of talent in DE can be very wide as it is in racing and so naturally their will DE drivers that have better skills and judgement than some racers.

dmwhite

the lines that are taught at DE's are not always the fastest way around the track...

JClark

Rennlist at its finest.

M758

The DE line tends to be more "safe" and has more margin for error. The Race line can be brokend into two types. Qualfying and race. The qulifying line is all about lap time and usse the DE line in places and other uses a more dangerious albeit faster line. Braking in a corner is a big no-no in most DE groups, but required in racing.

Now the "racing" part of the race is very different since you are working to both maintain speed and position. Often times you need to give up some speed to maintain stronger postion on track to defend a corner.

Giacomo

In a DE you are basically driving by yourself. In a race you may be driving with someone immediately beside you, ahead of you who is unlikely to give you a point by or behind you and must defend some inside lines.

I like that in races I don't have to put my arm out for a point by or wait to receive one. If the racer behind me is faster they will find a way around. More and more upper DE run groups started to be populated with GT3's and cup cars and since passing is not allowed in corners you often can't take the corner at full speed and then can't pass the car ahead without a serious lift... Easier and more fun to just go racing.

BostonDMD

DMD to be correct......

Racing has made me a better DE driver.....

and yes, this thread reminds me of one of mine in my younger days......

TedA

Boston..what goes around comes around ....you rock