TT Gasman

What if your car has a lap timer from the factory? Almost all the new 997s have it as part of the sportchrono option, Porsche even details how to use it in the manual.

gottagofast13

A good friend of mine just totaled his car two weekends ago at a Kansas City Region DE at Heartland Park. He's a very conservative driver in his Audi TT...he entered a 70mph turn a little too quickly for the wet conditions, turned, and the car didn't respond.

Luckily he did buy HPDE Insurance and his check is in the mail right now.

DarkSideDE

And he should have his check tomorrow ;-)

Bob Rouleau

Mike, all we can do is take whatever steps needed to make sure DE participants know that it isn't a race. My experience is that he real racers are not a problem. It's the wannabe's that can be a problem.

bella1

While it is true that the insurer will determine coverage in the event of a claim, the insurer's agent could have some exposure. For example, if I tell my insured he is covered at a DE event (which I would never do by the way), then he is covered. If my insurer denies the claim, then my Errors and Omissions Liability Policy would become involved. So if an agent is willing to put in writing that DE is covered, then I say that is good enough for me!

Phokaioglaukos

I've not yet met the agent who is willing to take on that liability, but there probably is one out there someplace. Of course a claim against the agent in the circumstance where the agent mistakenly said there was coverage where the policy did not provide coverage is a lot different than a claim covered under the policy language. Not the kind of claim I want to own.

My advice stands, read your policy to see if it excludes DE. It'll take you longer to dig out a copy of your policy than it will take you to find the "racing" exclusion and determine whether it has been broadened to cover DE also.

gottagofast13

Great advice. It doesn't take much time to do a simple review of your policy. I haven't read a policy yet that wasn't very clear on the subject.

If your policy wording looks to exclude DEs but your agent says you're covered, I wouldn't take the chance of expecting the claim to be paid. Yes, the agent's Errors and Omissions policy SHOULD pay for the claim if the insurer denies it, but that's not a chance that I would suggest taking. Even if the E&O policy comes through, I would expect the claim process to be much longer in duration.

Spartan

Do you mind telling us whom he was insured through?

sbarton

When shopping for a new policy, where can you get a copy of the policy for your state before you purchase so you can compare policies?

Last time I was looking for insurance, every time I explained what DE was (ie, NOT racing) and mentioned race track, they immediately said I would not be covered without even looking into it or asking a superior for more info. They also basically said I should look elsewhere for street insurance. So since I could not ask any agents for info, I started looking online for policies that did not exclude DE. I finally found one that had a sample policy (Progressive). The sample online was for a different state then I am in. It did not exclude DE's, but when I purchased my insurance and got the actual policy a few weeks later, it specifically excluding any events on a racing surface.


So, how do you go about comparing policies when agents won't talk to you and sample policies for your state are not readily available online (atleast least time I checked, 2 years ago)?

-Scott

NaroEscape

In NC, insurers are not allowed to write a track exclusion - or so says my insurance agent. They can only word it as "Competitive Racing". Now, if you have a claim, like I have seen a few people have, they will pay and promptly drop you from coverage.

I rolled my 914 up at Limerock while living in NJ back in 2000. I wasn't sure if I was covered, so I called the insurance agent and explained everything in detail. She asked " were you on the racing surface when you wrecked", I said "well, kinda, I was on the side in the grass". She again said "so you were not ACTUALLY on the paved racing surface when you wrecked the car". I said "No Mam, I was on the grass at the side of the track", she then said "no problem, an adjuster will be out to see the damage and cut you a check" which happened 1 week later....

Noel

You're welcome. My rates are higher because of that.

My motto is don't take to the track a car that you can't afford to total.

NaroEscape

That has nothing to do with your rates being high. It's all the uninsured motorists that insurers have to pay out on.

forgive me, but I spent $4000 per year for 15 years with never a claim. I got $3000 back. Have you ever had a claim? Ever? If they were willing to pay (did you read the part that I explained EXACTLY what happened, full disclosure and all, or were you too willing to judge immediately), should I just tell them "no, that's ok, I know I'm covered but don't send me the money".

My policy covered it anyway, the point was they didn't drop me because of it being a track incident.

gottagofast13

HPDE Insurance Program: http://hpdeins.locktonaffinity.com

gottagofast13

At the end of the day, most agents are trying to write a policy for someone with average exposures. Many of them are compensated based on premium sold and loss ratio (claims/premium) of their book of business. Regardless of how few incidents there are in this hobby, an agent does take on more exposure by insuring someone who tracks their car.

Most agents will not want to write coverage for you if you say anything about "race track" or "high-performance driving." I'd say your safest bet is to talk with friends and review their policies. Unfortunately, I think you'll find that unless you're in NC you will have some sort of non-competitive track exclusion: "surface used for racing", "at a racetrack", or even "in a driver's education event."

There are a few good dedicated DE insurance options out there. At this point, I think this is the smartest and safest route to go.

George from MD

".... When I look at a typical DE lately, I see a significant percentage of the paddock occupied by guys in race suits driving race cars. Said race cars come to the events in big rigs which sometimes make me wonder if we are having a DE or did I mistakenly show up at an ALMS race! I can see how it might be difficult for an insurance adjuster to distinguish between a race and a PCA/BMW etc. DE.

In simpler times, DE was populated mostly by street cars which were driven to the event. That at least lent some credence to the notion that it was 'Driver Education". Today .. well, let's say it is harder to explain."

Boy is that the truth! I've only been doing this for ten or twelve years and the changes are phenomenal. The instructors are usually the guys with the old cars.