mike1111

As to the comment on the other turbo It just looked to me he got on the power sooner, and I have to say you did a great job on recovery. I have been driving on sebring for 4 years now in a 500 hp 930, I am no expert but i usually track out more on that turn. Also if that was your only incident you are doing great. I have stayed on gas and some times increased gas and have drifted out of that situation. I will also be at sebring this weekend with my new to me gt3. Now I to have to learn to drive and not rely on hp to keep up.

DogInBlack

I'm with C.J.- you are accelerating out of 17 well after a nice apex but hold tight. I think you ran out of grip once you slightly unweight the rear with the bump. You had already run the large bump at the bridge. There isn't a car directly next to you and the yellow car in front of you tracks out properly.

Nice catch!

sbelles

Obviously you shouldn't be tracking such an expensive high horse powered beast!

Just pack an extra pair of shorts this weekend. Wish I was going to be there.

gums

Are you guys watching this other thread?
See:
"I don't know why you guys do this...."

Veloce Raptor

LMFAO...lather rinse repeat!

Tom...Holy Code Brown Moment, Batman!! Wow, helluva nice, clean, calm save.

What did your passenger do on your switch panel right before your spin??? Did he turn something off or on?

To me, the sound indicated that--as is human--your foot came on & off the throttle rapidly as the frequency of the bumps pushed the floorboard up to your feet. It also sounded as if the rear was VERY stiff, considering how dramatic sounding the on/off was. Sounded as if it happened to be "off" at the split second the rear got light over a bump, making it very unsettled, whereupon when it got back "on" again, and the turbo came on, around she went.

mark kibort

you dont get it. its instinct to be thinking that neutral is 10 and 2. If you are off by even a few degrees, this inhibits you natural ability to know where 0 is and to what degree you are applying steering input. as racers, we go into turns like that at far greater speeds, on all sorts of track conditions, and all sorts of different lines, taking all sorts of action. (gas, brake, avoidance, etc etc). by keeping your hands neutral, especally in a DE on stree tires, you can respond and correct much easier, and not go past the point of no return quite as easy.
One of the other things to think about. ever notice that on some "pushy" turns, it doesnt matter how far you turn the wheel, as the capable arc path of the car is realized. with his hands in this position, his brain was turning the car with his refereces off a little the "feel " is removed to a certain extent with the power steering, so in the end, he could have too much input. the 20 or so extra degrees is certainly enough to start the car to step out when the rear end holding capabilities are exceeded. His reaction time, already at a 20 degree disadvantage , is part of the reason he is not able to catch it in time. I would bet that same turn at the same speed with the hands in the proper position, might have yielded a non event. Ive had plenty of student drivers when i helped out DE groups, do this and the feed back was always positive.

And i if you look at my hands on my 928, it is always at a 10 reference point. (neutral and centered) the "2" is sometimes missing due to my gear shift issue. now that i finally have some stability in the shifter area, you can see the other hand spending more time at the 2 position. by the way, watching max angelli in car, and even kleinubing, there are many times where they are comfortable enough to drive with one hand. but if you watch them, they always are at 10-2, always!
The 928 power steering is easy enough to contol with one hand. the key point is that one hand or two, they need to be centered, and certainly not be moving or shuffling around the wheel. I think even you can agree with that.

Sounds like you might need a few laps against the 21 year old junkyard, one handed bandit, 928.
I think i might be GTS-4 Ill have to check!

mk

mark kibort

I dont think it caused the slide, i think it kept him from feeling the slide and reacting quick enough to it. the hand position on the wheel seems like only a couple of inches off, but thats near 20 degrees. we react so quickly by feel and instinct, that when your control stick is that far preloaced in the wrong direction, it can cause a lag or over correction in reacton to the car breaking loose. If you want proof, center your steering wheel off about 2 degrees and go drive a mountain road. Its not very comfortable.

If you watch the video carefully and watch his hand positions. when most of us start to let the wheel uncoil at this point in a sweeper , or go to neutral on the exit, picture where his hands would normally be on the wheel, just before it starts to break loose. you will notice that the position is still fairly up on the dash, indicating a pretty high level of steering input, for an exit of a sweeper. However, based on the skewed hand position, he wouldnt take notice of that because both hands are near even,. (but they arent really)
the slide starts under power, due to sligtly too much input and componding the issue is the correction is not given a fair start either, due to them being off the 20 degrees as well.

Now, his correction was awesome. he did a nice correct and uncoil of the wheel and just slide down the middle. slides are are all about feel as street cars have so much rotation lock to lock. On an indy car or spec racer, you could do that without moving your hands, but in our street car race car conversions, its elbows and .... when it gets way bent out of shape. (or when you go drifting )

Mk

DrJupeman

Instinct?

Larry Herman

I don't know how much I subscribe to this on a top level. I do understand your points, and it probably holds true for many drivers, but I cannot imagine that a pro or top level amateur racer depends on their hand position to know where straight ahead is. I honestly think that if one cannot feel it in the wheel and in the attitude of the car, then they are not there yet. I have seen it in videos and I myself have cranked in close to a full turn of the wheel to counter a slide, and have come right back to center. Try that with your hands locked at 10 & 2.

BTW, I think that the yellow stripe on the Cup Car wheels is pretty funny. If you are looking at it to see where straight ahead on the wheel is, you've got bigger problems than that.

Veloce Raptor

Agree 100% on both points.

Bryan Watts

BS.

1) I know where 0 is no matter where I move my hands...it's called feel. You can feel it in the wheel and your body/mind can remember how much you've turned the wheel. You're already processing a few thousand other things while cornering...it's certainly not outside of your mind's ability to keep track of how much you've turned the wheel as well.

2) When applying counter steer, the "center" is meaningless. You apply counter steer until the point that you catch the slide...it matters not where center is, only that you have enough feel to turn the wheel appropriately. My thought process is never that I need to get back to center and then go 10 degrees more...I simply react and turn the wheel until I feel the car settle back down and then turn the wheel back until the car is going in the direction I want it to go again. As much as I think drifting is a silly sport, watch those guys for a minute and tell me whether they care where "center" is when they move their hands all over the wheel.

tkerrmd

the full monty suspension set up!!

tkerrmd

great comments, thanks!!

DogInBlack

Yeah, and you're a douche on this thread too

tkerrmd

That my friend is FUNNY!!!!