Professor Helmüt Tester

Non-issue. Shuffle if you want, when you want, where you want. Non-shuffle nannys are probably liberals.

I shuffle all the the time when racing in the rain. Probably do it 10-30% of the time in the dry, depending on the corner, traffic and just exactly what car I'm racing.

Air-bag thing is silly. If you're about to hit something, TAKE YOUR F#*KING HANDS OFF THE WHEEL, STUPID. REGARDLESS OF HOW YOU STEER OR WHICH END OF THE CAR IS GOING TO HIT FIRST, "PULL HANDS OFF WHEEL". More injuries are caused by "whipping wheel" than probably any other thing. Trust me...I have LOTS of experience here.

Larry Herman

I find that it has to do with how far I turn the wheel, how fast I have to turn the wheel, for how long, and how much effort it takes. If it's less than 90 deg, I always keep my hands where they are. If it's a quick turn of the wheel (even if it's a lot), I still hold my hands at 3 & 9. If it's a long sweeper, I may reposition the "outside" hand back to 3 or 9 just to have better feel and more leverage (especially if it's manual steering).

BTW I saw Rorhl reposition his hands in that video, when he needed to hold a big turn of the wheel for a while.

MTosi

No most likely they are the good drivers, the professionals, or the ones passing you....sry couldn't help myself

sweanders

Got any thumbs left?

Bryan Watts

I see people making a distinction between "shuffle steering" and moving your hands. I've always had them equated by people who suggested that 9 & 3 was the ONLY way to drive. What say ye? How would you non shufflers describe the technique in this video (it's not me)?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr_ByuzFCuY

SundayDriver

This topic always cracks me up. There are two camps - one says shuffle steering is evil - to listen to them you would think that shuffle steering is responsible for terrorism, high gas prices and bad weather. The other camp says it is a tool, like any other.

Why would anyone who understands how many variables there are with driving at the limit, ever completely write off any tool? Include me in the camp that uses shuffle steering when I feel it is appropriate (and God forbid, I even do it in my sports racer from time to time).

MTosi

exactley, hes not shuffling his hands. He knows how much correction he's going to need so he repositions his hands for that amount, and those spots almost become his new 10 and 2, until he's done with the corrections then he goes back his regular 10 and 2. He's not moving his hands when its un called for only when he needs to since he's using more than one turn of the wheel.

Sean F

What do you think shuffle steering is? We're not talking about driving the bus.

Flying Finn

The way I'd descibe that, it was "moving your hands" not shuffle steering which are two different things.

I basically never "move" my hands and insist it's not good way to steer but that to me is acceptable. "shuffle steering" (the way I understand it is to steer so that your hads are always close to 9-3 position regardless of where your steering wheel points to) on the other had is not.

Same thing with 9-3, for example Jean Alesi holds his hand in more like 10-2 position and he is great & fast driver.

Call me a liberal or friggin' nanny but I still think not shuffling is the way to teach someone who is learning.

I have no doubt there is someone really quick who holds the steering wheel with one hand on top of the steering wheel (like all Mustang drivers...) while other hand rests comfortably on top of the gear lever but that doesn't mean it's a good way of steering.

And I agree with the professor about the airbag thing, how the hell can that be a reason for insisting on shuffle?!

Professor Helmüt Tester

Find a dictionary...look up "prevaricate". There is no such thing as "a little pregnant".

M758

I suffle steer sometimes and sometimes not. I want to make sure my hands and arms are in a comfortable position and I have the leverage I need to control the car. Some times that requires me to reposition my hands. I think it defeats the purpose of holding a fixed position when it makes it harder to control the car. For a novice it is some that should be tough as a NO-NO. The reason is that its in general a bad habit. As drivers progess in skill they can add it back it as needed and only where needed.

It is the same thing for trail braking. For novices you "ALWAYS brake in a straight line". However all advnaced racers know that doing that just makes you slow. Still we don't teach it to novices as it just causes problems. Better to start without it and then add it back in as tool when the driver can clearly determine what is the right time.

MTosi

What are you getting at? you'll have to forgive my poor analysis this morning. I've always had a terrible time trying to describe the whole shuffling v moving hands thing. I know its "one in the same" but I can explain what I'm getting at better in person using my hands, lol.

I think saying "Shuffling hands" is the description of a driving style not the actual motion. Since obv. when you are shuffling your hands you are moving them, but thats not the point.

I'll give it a go
shuffling hands- When the person is never really at 10 and 2 or 9 and 3 they are always "Shuffling" their hands, even when they don't need to, there hands some times stay in the same spot and they simply pass the steering wheel around.

moving hands- When a driver who needs more than one turn of the steering wheel, moves his hands once (if you want to say "shuffles" fine go ahead) does his business than resumes 10 and 2. When its a prof. driver they often know how much over one turn they will need and will sometimes one hand it, with one hand at either 10 and 2 and then when they come back around, then pick up the other spoke with their other hand.

Bryan Watts

Whereas I prefer to "rest" my hands at 4 & 8 as a starting point for adjusting my hands for each corner.

Seth Thomas

You have only driven the car once or twice during the last 3-4 years ;-)

I am not a fan of shuffle steering on the track. I don't teach it to anyone because most of the time it causes the driver to be too rough with the wheel. They cause too many movements of the steering wheel which causes small movements of the chassis/balance of the car. There isn't a turn on any racetrack that I have found to cause me or anyone else to shuffle steer including T7 @ Sebring, T7 @ Road Atlanta, hairpin @ Infiineon, and the list goes on. I am not saying shuffle steering does not work at all. I am saying shuffle steering with most people does not work.

Here are some in-car videos of good examples where shuffle steering is never needed during a race or track event.

Joey Hand Over Should In-Car

My Sebring In-Car

VIR In-Car

ajcjr

this may be a stupid question but what is shuffle steering, i never heard the term before.