Car155

I’m planning to put racing seats in my DE, maybe future CR, ’86 951. I would like to be at least upgradable to a full head and neck protection setup. I drive to the track and for fun on weekends so I can’t do anything that is track only.

The options that I have come up with are:

Kirkey aluminum road racing seat with bolt-on aluminum head supports
Sparco EVO carbon fiber seat with bolt-on head support ($$$)
(for both remove head supports on the street)
Sparco EVO fiberglass seat with BSR right side net

I have tried the Sparco Circuit with the integral head supports and I have no peripheral vision at all (I am 5’ 8”). It seems like it would be very dangerous to drive on the street. All the similar Recaros look like they have the same problem. The Sparco Touring at least looks like it has holes in the right place although it is “strongly recommended for track only”.

All the archive discussions seem to be for track only cars. Recommendations? Other options?

Thanks

Chris

vegasgolf98

Cobra - many options

carreracup21

One thing I don't hear people talking about much is emergency egress through the drivers side window with the lateral head support seats. You may not have a problem in the 951 ? , but I have a terrible time in my 964. Add a window net into the mix with helmet on and it becomes a serious challenge. I have the Recaro Hans seat and I'm heading for the passenger window if I have a problem.

chrisp

The other thing people don't talk about is how hard these seats are. Not for my butt or back but for my head. When I drive on the street I am very conscious of what's going on behind me. I can only immagine that getting rear ended would slam my head into the back of the seat and would be similar to hitting a hard, unpadded surface (because that's what it is). I sometimes pad my headrest area with a folded up fleece vest when I think of it. It's not much but it will definitely help in an on-street accident. Someone needs to make a pad that provides protection. There are a lot of folks using race seats on the street.

RedlineMan

Hey Chris;

You raise some good points. There are definite trade offs in a lot of this stuff. What works great for track can actually be dangerous for street, like having a roll bar near your head.

Your voiced concern seems mostly about vision. A Halo needs to be positioned properly to work for both street and track. The top of the halo should be at the tip of your nose when seated. That way you are looking over it, like the one that I fabricated for my Kirkey RR Deluxe.



Seats are a very personal thing, and adding a halo into the mix really makes it difficult for people of different sizes to find one that works.

If you are looking at Kirkey, there are different options, which is nice. I would offer that the older style bolt on wings (#00100/00200) are pretty useless. When you consider that the average head can "weigh" as much as 900lbs in a 30g impact, those thin little wings won't do much.

The Kirkey RR Deluxe is NOT a seat that I have had a lot of success with. The layback (20 degree) design makes it VERY difficult to get positioned properly in a sedan. I have tried with my own 944 and in a 996, and the result was FAR less than optimal. In my opinion, they are not to be considered.

Seemingly, the better choice would be the new "Full Containment" model. It is a component seat that you can order with differing size sub-assemblies for different size drivers. It is indeed a deep full containment seat, and may be tricky for street use, but at least it has the modern high tech safety features that are also custom configurable without the custom price.

Alas, this seat falls afoul of the same problem as the RR Deluxe; it is only available in 20 degree layback. I have spoken to Kirkey about also offering a 10 degree "upright" version of both of these, but they have not taken my advice as of yet. A big mistake if you really know how a seat is supposed to work, because there's DON'T!

I have had great success with Ultrashield seats lately. LINK - https://rennlist.com/forums/racing-and-drivers-education-forum/165281-ultrashield-race-seat-product-review.html They offer really well built products at decent prices. The Road Race SS ($1065 custom sizing included) and Lightweight RR ($650 + $100 for custom) I installed in a customer 951 racer have worked extremely well and gotten good reviews from everyone that has tried them. No conection with them, just satisfied.

I see head containment as somewhere near a 90% concern; Once you have 90% of the rest of the safety puzzle complete, think about it. You might want to think about utilizing head containment long and hard for a dual use car. It is a compromise that may not pay great dividends in every siutation without a lot of other things to go with it, and then be too much of a burden for street use.

Weigh the options, make informed decisions, then drive accordingly!

Geo

Actually, I made some comments at the bottom of p2 of the thread John provided a link to.

Short version, I tried a full containment seat while at Hubbard-Downing getting my HANS and getting in and out was a real challenge and that wasn't even inside a car. And, the seat was a great fit. I'm sure I would be more motivated if I were on fire, but it scares me a bit just how long it took to get out of the thing. Perhaps with practice it would be second nature.

carreracup21

Geo,
I tried getting out my drivers side window from the al buttoned up position. Conclusion: it ain't gonna happen. I'm going for the other side, unless I can simply open the door.

Adam Richman

In talking w/ someone at BSR (that helped in building one of the first Crawford DP cars for the Rolex series from what he said), he commented that when running head containment seats you should run an inboard safety net and it should ride _inside_ the head containment. Without this, a driver's head can come forward or outside the seat and not back inside the head containment area and create more problems than they would have had otherwise. As with all safety equipment, its meant to work as a system (or in this case, parts might be needed to cure an unforseen ill of the system ??). Best of luck.

mitch236

To answer the question, maybe consider some of the bolt on halo solutions. That way you could bolt on for the track and off for street. I can tell you one thing about track seats. They are not comfortable. I've tried the Sparco 2000, Touring and now have the Ultrashield SS installed. The Sparcos are definately more comfortable than the rock-hard ultrashield.

edit: for sale posting by Rennlist members only

John Brown

The cages, harness bars, seats, and harness installed for track may constitute an overall reduction in safety used on the street.

And especially the cage bars and the head restraint wings or halos certainly could be viewed as hard blunt objects when riding around without a helmet. And obstructions to full vision.

Dual use cars are a conundrum.