Hello all,

I've been a car enthusiast my whole life, but never owned a Porsche. I'm of an age now where I prefer the height and room an SUV affords me, and to that end I've been looking at/test driving the Cayenne.

But I'm planning to buy used, and looking at the "S" model. That said, what should I look for? Any model years to avoid? Any generation that has more issues than most? Etc.

I've been using car forums since they were list serves, and have always appreciated receiving and giving the wisdom they offer. I look forward to the same experience here.

Thanks in advance,
Sam

 

Sam, as a long time car forum user - you probably know that the better the question you ask, the better the answers will be.. so - a few details that might help:

1 - Your budget? Used Cayenne S's range from $10,000 to $60,000. Some idea of where in that spectrum you want to end up would be useful.

2 - What years have you test driven?

3 - To what use are you going to put it? Garage queen to daily driver range?

4 - Where are you located?

 

Fair questions, Don.

At this time I'm keeping my options open on pricing but would prefer to stay $30k or less.

It will be a daily driver, my primary car.

As for my location and years I've driven, again, I'm only looking for advice on what to look for or avoid. I know with my RX7's it was suggested to avoid the first model year for a variety of reasons. For my sister's Mazda she was to avoid one whole generation of the car due to many maintenance issues associated with it. With my Acura I needed to be careful not to buy the generation that had a horrible transmission problem, etc.

Since I'm buying used, I just want to call on the collective wisdom of current drivers. As I've never had any experience with Porsche's I really don't know where to begin researching. Any help is appreciated.

 

$30K you are looking all the way up to likely a 2009 TurboS and can afford to be very picky as this should buy the best of the best Turbo and very nice Turbo S with higher mileage. 958 I don't know enough about but pretty sure they are still in the mid to high $30Ks for the S models.

You should have another car as a backup for when things happen--this is not a Toyota Do some searches there are tons of threads on reliability, things to look for, etc.

Good luck!

 

Thanks, VentoGT.

I'd prefer to avoid a turbo this time around. I thought the S model was just the V8 engine. I have no interest in the future maintenance issues with a used turbo, been there, done that.

 

There's absolutely no reason to avoid the turbo.

 

I would look for a 2012 to 2014 S. Make sure the Vario Cam bolts are not the aluminum ones (search this forum for details). Transfer cases seem to be crapshoot based on my recent research. If everything checks out and works, and you have some history on maintenance, expect to pay $32 to 40K for a 2012 based on mileage. It is almost 10K a year after that based on similar options. Do you want PASM, LCA, Bose, a hitch, 20" wheels, Premium Package or Premium Package +, 14 way power seats, rear view camera, side shades, XM, etc. Do you want a CPO with warranty? Special paint? I just bought a 12/11 build 2012 with 62k from a 3rd party dealer for $32.5. Original list was $85,005. Use the VIN decoder on this forum, pay for Edmunds, CARFAX, and Stuttcars.com for info. on the potential buy once you get serious on a particular S. My Cayenne S had all of the options mentioned (as well as a couple of others) FYI as well except the CPO.

 

I would second that. My research indicated that there was no reason to avoid the turbo and lots of reasons to look for one.

My '08 CTT is my fourth Porsche and about my 40th high end German car. I have not owned the newer 2011+ 958 generation but I am on my second early Cayenne, my first being a bought new 2004 Cayenne S. I really like the Cayennes, few cars are as versatile.

I do not believe there is a good year of just about ANY Porsche to be perfectly honest. Just about every model I am aware of has a fatal flaw, usually what I call the Porsche engine lottery. Some just plain fail, and they are obscenely expensive to repair. Just know that if your V8 Cayenne develops scored cylinders it is essentially totaled at that point. It seems as though it can happen to any of them. The worst are early cold weather based S models but it is even reported on very new Porsches...

Then all of the 955/957 V8 models are subject to failed plastic cooling pipes, some large, some small, all destined to fail at some point. It will need repairs and they will be in the thousands every time if you have to pay to get the work done.

Some reasons to consider the turbo models over the S...

Full leather interior. I like this better than the turbo motor even, sooooo nice compared to the plastic dash cars.

Turbo's come loaded, no need to check for heated seats, standard. Lots of options like that on the cars.

The TT V8, even with sometimes comical turbo lag it is a HOOT!

Some say... because the turbo's use under piston oil squirters they are less prone to cylinder bore scoring.

Just know what you are getting into. Just owning this car out of warranty sometimes gives me panic attacks. Then there are days like today when someone wants to play on the mountain road... I love this car. I figure if you are going to roll the dice this big on a car you might as well get as much of the experience as they offered. The CTT is an awesome experience. The S is nice but honestly in a 955/957 I would go turbo. Wait, I did

Good Luck!

 

Cayenne turbo is rock solid especially the 08 and beyond (957). Get the pdcc and be blown away. Read the stickies. Everything you need to know is in there. Once you have learned more and have some candidates, repost and we can offer our (endless) opinions . Good luck!

 

OK, so we're looking for reliable and something that can take some miles/time on it without becoming boring..Perhaps my question wasn't clear - I was wondering what year/models you've tried driving... that helps us giving suggestions on what else you might want to try.

Location was asked because someone may know of a local killer deal - and if it was close enough to you - they could pass it on.
Well, here is a good spot to start your research. There is a ton of info available here - unfortunately not broken out as well as could be by model/series of Cayenne.. but here is a rough breakdown:

2003-2006, Series 955 (Porsche internal number for the general series of vehicles), Came in a V6, V8 and a twin-turbo V8. Surprisingly - the Twin Turbo was probably the most reliable. Problem areas are a few:
Early ones had lots of teething bugs, particularly with electronics. ALL the V8 engines had cooling system problems with plastic pipes where aluminum should have been used. Porsche made replacement pipe in aluminum available, and paid some of us off under a class-action lawsuit. ALL of the 955 suffer from "cardan shaft bearing" problem - it's actually just the basic main driveshaft to the rear, the center bearing is held in a rubber mount that goes bad. Fix can range from $15 (Jimi Fix) to $2,500 (dealer price.) Some (rare but it happens) V8 vehicles from very cold climates had a problem with piston clearances on one cylinder, causing scoring of the cylinder wall and the piston. It's rare - but very expensive when it happens. The ones it happens to are often not worth enough to bother fixing it - they get parted out. The S model is most prone to the problem. Less so the twin-turbo, and not at all on the V6. Early 955's also sometimes experience rough shifting - caused by binding valves in the automatic transmission. There are rebuilt valve bodies available to fix the problem. Figure $1,500 or so at a good independent.

2007 - there was no 2007 in the US - but Porsche sold a "Titanium/S" edition into what would normally be the 2007 model year - and they sold it as a 2006 vehicle. It was a "put lipstick on this pig" sort of model (I owned one) - some special paint, interior, trim stuff to move out the remaining 955 bodies.

2008-2010 - 957 - a "facelift" of the 955 body. New front end, lights in the rear, interior much the same, the V8 engines got bigger and more powerful. Most of the bugs were gone - with the exception of the cardan shaft. That continued to be an issue. Porsche also came out with a GTS series, and a Turbo/S - the GTS is a turbo without turbos, and the Turbo/S is a turbo on steroids (they bumped up the performance - mostly a software change..) There are some coolant leak problems reported on the V8 engines due to a glued-in fitting on the bridge between the two cylinder heads. Fixes range from screwing it in, to JB Weld to replacing the entire assembly. A dealer will want to remove the engine and replace the entire assembly. Unnecessary - but they have to warranty it so they do it "by the book.."

2011 to current - 958 series. Brand new body, driveline, interior design, basically a new vehicle. Came pretty well debugged from the factory, there wasn't the usual beta-year problems with the 2011's. Lineup consisted of the V6 engine, the S V8 engine and a twin-turbo V8 engine (500HP - it's FUN!)

In 2014 there was a 958.2 series (which then made the original one become the 958.1) - some small exterior styling changes, interiors the same, engine choices the same. A bit later - a diesel engine option was added, and the S went from a V8 engine to a V6 turbo engine. There is also a GTS option - which is basically a turbo (with the turbo styling and options) without the turbos. And of course a Turbo/S - which is just plain silly and wonderful all at the same time.

Those are the rough outlines of what's available. At 30K you're pretty solidly into the 958 series, and an early S. I saw one 2011 958 Twin Turbo listed today for $38,000 - 79,000 miles. That seemed low. Most of the 958 TT's start at around $45,000 now and go up with less miles and newer model year.

There were a few things to watch for on the V8 engine cars - 2011 had a problem with an engineering error on the "VarioCam" valve timing assembly. Porsche didn't really admit it in the US, but did everywhere else. It may never cause a problem on the majority of cars - but if it does cause a problem, it might be relatively minor (less than $4k) to major (new engine at $31k.) Due to the high upside cost - I elected to have mine fixed at my expense by Porsche - about $2,600. Peace of mind sort of thing. You can find out about it by searching for WC-22.

There have also been reports of "transfer case" problems on all the gasoline model 958's. Again - not all of them experience it, but it is a concern - figure around $4k to get it fixed if it happens. It probably won't happen, but be forewarned.

That's about it for the 958. The complex electronics are pretty damn reliable, it's a wonderful driving vehicle, and the early 958's are selling for a fraction of the new cost now - making them less expensive than much more boring cars - at least to buy.

On all Porsches - service at a dealer is generally pretty good and quite expensive. Happily - there seem to be enough decent independents around that it shouldn't bankrupt you to own one. Figure on expenses of $2,000 or so a year - just in case - and to cover brakes and tires. Both can be a cost if the car is driven with enthusiasm.

All that said - there is no other car I've found (and I've owned about 50..) that is as satisfying to drive. It makes me feel good driving it. The driving is never a chore.

Have fun looking - and let us know what you find and I'm sure you'll get lots of comments and suggestions.

 

I'll second that. On the V8 engines - the turbos are MORE reliable than the normally aspirated ones. Go figure.. they got that turbo technology figured out (but they've also been doing it for a LONG time..)

 

I'll third that the Turbo is as reliable or more than the S model on any generation.
Note that brake rotors on the 2006 (955) Turbo S and 2009-2010 Turbo models are not cheap.

 

957 gts is superb and available with 6speed manual. A absolute blast.

 

FYI: Back in the day, I bought a new first generation Cayenne S and it was a great vehicle...but I regretted not getting the turbo and wont make that mistake again.

 

OP, do you do your own wrenching? If not, then it is highly advised to get a CPO car. Owning a Porsche naked is something you should not take lightly if you are unwilling to part with 1k, 2k, 4k at any given time. Seeing as you have come from japanese cars this will take some adjustment. I second the person recommending a second vehicle as well.