You guys have scared the bejebus out of me...
01-26-2011, 02:45 PM
#91
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
....calls VW...."HELP!"
.....Builds 914.....MAKES MONEY
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
....calls VW...."HELP!"
....Builds 924.....MAKES MONEY
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
....Builds 928....MAKES MONEY!
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
...Redesigns 924 into 944.....MAKES MONEY...
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s."
Blends 914 idea with 911 to come up with Boxter.....Makes money
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s."
Calls VW...."Help"
Comes out with Cayenne. (Which according to the literature is more Porsche than VW. I tend to believe that more than you unless you can come up with some sort of documentation). MAKES MONEY!!!!
....and that silly 911 is still just a VW from day 1 so who cares
01-26-2011, 02:46 PM
#92
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Cause Porsche is the true definition of insanity. "Building the same car over and over and over agian and expecting a different result"
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
....calls VW...."HELP!"
.....Builds 914.....MAKES MONEY
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
....calls VW...."HELP!"
....Builds 924.....MAKES MONEY
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
....Builds 928....MAKES MONEY!
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
...Redesigns 924 into 944.....MAKES MONEY...
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s."
Blends 914 idea with 911 to come up with Boxter.....Makes money
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s."
Calls VW...."Help"
Comes out with Cayenne. (Which according to the literature is more Porsche than VW. I tend to believe that more than you unless you can come up with some sort of documentation). MAKES MONEY!!!!
....and that silly 911 is still just a VW from day 1 so who cares
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
....calls VW...."HELP!"
.....Builds 914.....MAKES MONEY
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
....calls VW...."HELP!"
....Builds 924.....MAKES MONEY
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
....Builds 928....MAKES MONEY!
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s"
...Redesigns 924 into 944.....MAKES MONEY...
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s."
Blends 914 idea with 911 to come up with Boxter.....Makes money
Porsche "Gee...our company is going out of business because we can't sell enough of these 911s."
Calls VW...."Help"
Comes out with Cayenne. (Which according to the literature is more Porsche than VW. I tend to believe that more than you unless you can come up with some sort of documentation). MAKES MONEY!!!!
....and that silly 911 is still just a VW from day 1 so who cares
01-26-2011, 03:14 PM
#93
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Thread Starter
01-26-2011, 05:02 PM
#95
Race Director
Enjoyed your post but the part above is a commonly stated misconception, an attempted putdown by some, and is incorrect. Sure, the very first Porsches borrowed a lot from VW due to Ferdinand and Ferry's ties to that company and the need to use available resources in building a new sports car in Germany's post war environment. But over the course of the next 15 years, through the development of the many 356 and other models, virtually every original VW based part was completely re-engineered and replaced.
By the time the 911 debuted the only thing it had in common with VW was the fact that it was rear engined and air cooled. If that's the criteria for being the same, then I guess the Mustang is really a model T because they both have a front engine and water cooling.
Guess I just reacted to your comment because I'm in the middle of Excellence Was Expected, the 3 volume history of Porsche. An excellent read for any Porschephile or someone who enjoys reading about automotive history.
By the time the 911 debuted the only thing it had in common with VW was the fact that it was rear engined and air cooled. If that's the criteria for being the same, then I guess the Mustang is really a model T because they both have a front engine and water cooling.
Guess I just reacted to your comment because I'm in the middle of Excellence Was Expected, the 3 volume history of Porsche. An excellent read for any Porschephile or someone who enjoys reading about automotive history.
01-26-2011, 06:48 PM
#96
Enjoyed your post but the part above is a commonly stated misconception, an attempted putdown by some, and is incorrect. Sure, the very first Porsches borrowed a lot from VW due to Ferdinand and Ferry's ties to that company and the need to use available resources in building a new sports car in Germany's post war environment. But over the course of the next 15 years, through the development of the many 356 and other models, virtually every original VW based part was completely re-engineered and replaced.
By the time the 911 debuted the only thing it had in common with VW was the fact that it was rear engined and air cooled. If that's the criteria for being the same, then I guess the Mustang is really a model T because they both have a front engine and water cooling.
Guess I just reacted to your comment because I'm in the middle of Excellence Was Expected, the 3 volume history of Porsche. An excellent read for any Porschephile or someone who enjoys reading about automotive history.
By the time the 911 debuted the only thing it had in common with VW was the fact that it was rear engined and air cooled. If that's the criteria for being the same, then I guess the Mustang is really a model T because they both have a front engine and water cooling.
Guess I just reacted to your comment because I'm in the middle of Excellence Was Expected, the 3 volume history of Porsche. An excellent read for any Porschephile or someone who enjoys reading about automotive history.
Evolution, DNA, not innovation. The 911 evolved from the seeds of it's parents, VW.
Had nothing to do with sharing part numbers.
01-26-2011, 07:46 PM
#97
Race Director
There are a limited number of possible engine/drivetrain layouts for ICE's. You could just as easily say that every car designed in the last half century was not innovative but instead "evolved from the seeds of it's parents" or someone elses design. And it would be just as misleading and incorrect as saying the 911 simply evolved from the VW. Again, you should read Excellence Was Expected, the definitive history on the subject. Highly recommended.
01-26-2011, 10:07 PM
#99
Race Director
Your quote was "and that silly 911 is still just a VW from day 1 so who cares". That statement is simplistic and wrong. I pointed to an authoritative source that presents the issue in detail, but clearly you don't need to be confused by facts; your mind is made up. But hey, ignorance is bliss. Enjoy.
01-27-2011, 08:15 AM
#102
Rennlist Member
Who made the worse financial decision? The guy that buys a $25,000 Cayenne and drives it for 100k having to put $5-8k into it in repairs? Or the guy that paid $100k for it new and sold it with 50k on it for $25k(or less for the trade in).....but thinks he made the bet deal because he had a warranty
+1. And I'm no mechanic. Speaking of which, I bet there's a DIY on dropping your transmission and replacing the valve body out here somewhere...
01-27-2011, 08:21 AM
#103
Rennlist Member
I honestly think this is part of the issue. Poeple will run an american car to the ground and not thinkn anything of it. It can rattle, clank, pull to the left, stop like an oil tanker, turn like barge and they just don't care becaue that is what they "expect" from it.
All of the sudden when they buy a Porsche they expect a magical experience, especially if they bought one at new or near new prices. Every little problem now seems ten times bigger.
Repairs they would have DIY on another car they don't even attemp on the Porsche out of some mysterious fear.
Sure, some parts cost more, a lot more. But honestly some are actually cheaper than other brands.
EVERY car is going to have owners with random failures like a lifter. (i've lost a lifter on my 951, my Nissan truck, 67 Camaro, Chevy truck,) not like this is a Porsche only thing.
I see the list of issues on these things as pretty limited compared to many cars and worth dealing with for the bargain prices you can buy them for, for such a great suv.
Who made the worse financial decision? The guy that buys a $25,000 Cayenne and drives it for 100k having to put $5-8k into it in repairs?
Or the guy that paid $100k for it new and sold it with 50k on it for $25k(or less for the trade in).....but thinks he made the bet deal because he had a warranty
All of the sudden when they buy a Porsche they expect a magical experience, especially if they bought one at new or near new prices. Every little problem now seems ten times bigger.
Repairs they would have DIY on another car they don't even attemp on the Porsche out of some mysterious fear.
Sure, some parts cost more, a lot more. But honestly some are actually cheaper than other brands.
EVERY car is going to have owners with random failures like a lifter. (i've lost a lifter on my 951, my Nissan truck, 67 Camaro, Chevy truck,) not like this is a Porsche only thing.
I see the list of issues on these things as pretty limited compared to many cars and worth dealing with for the bargain prices you can buy them for, for such a great suv.
Who made the worse financial decision? The guy that buys a $25,000 Cayenne and drives it for 100k having to put $5-8k into it in repairs?
Or the guy that paid $100k for it new and sold it with 50k on it for $25k(or less for the trade in).....but thinks he made the bet deal because he had a warranty
01-27-2011, 03:28 PM
#104
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Why do some forum posters get so personal or make assumptions about others as if anointed the enlightened one.
Were just trying to help a poster by pointing out that the Cayenne has some issues that are unfortunately expensive to remedy and to purchase wisely.
Some people like to purchase new and others like or need to purchase pre-owned. Some pay cash and some finance. It's all fine -- and no one is correct.
Were just trying to help a poster by pointing out that the Cayenne has some issues that are unfortunately expensive to remedy and to purchase wisely.
Some people like to purchase new and others like or need to purchase pre-owned. Some pay cash and some finance. It's all fine -- and no one is correct.
