globed

Time for some TLC on my Carrera White GT3. While well cared for, I don't spend any time just staring at it. It looks great in white, cleans up well with a good hand wash, and doesn't show much in the way of scratches.

My guy specialises in SwissVax and more recently Modesto. I have the choice of normal SwissVax or Modesto BC-03 (more expensive) or Modesto Paul Dalton (even more expensive). The foundational work is the same in terms of clean up, clay bar, and so on.

Not sure what to do here. Some thoughts from you wax experts???

Thank you!

Dan

AudiOn19s

What are you needs for protection? You're comparing waxes vs. coatings which are both forms or protection but in very different ways.

Also, assuming your avatar is valid this will be on a white vehicle correct?

Waxes are the old industry standard. Protective products based on the natural ingredient of Carnauba wax. To this day wax is considered to be the protectant that will provide the most beautiful, deep, dark and soft appearance for your paint. The drawback to wax is the life expectancy of the protection, depending on the use of the vehicle and the environment that it lives in you should expect no more than 3- 6 months of protection from a wax, in many cases much shorter periods of protection. One of my favorite pre-show waxes I used to use would give me maybe 6 weeks before it was completely dead. I didn't care I loved the way it worked and loved applying it so it worked out for me. Swissvax makes some fantastic products, their Concorso is one of my favorites. You should check which Swissvax your dealer is going to apply as there are probably more than a dozen, including a Paul Dalton version (Crystal Rock). More info here:

http://www.swissvax.us/usa/waxes.html

None of the products you mention are Sealants...but Sealants are synthetic based protection, generally in liquid form, that are generally easier to work with and benefit from longer protection periods. It's pretty common to easily get 6 months out of a sealant up to say maybe 9 months...again these statements are hard to put into reality for say a car that sits inside 90% of the time and only comes out on nice days on the weekends vs. a daily driver. Bigger names in this segment would be Zaino, Klasse, etc...basically most everyone makes sealants these days too. Downside to sealants are some of them can be tricky to work with but most importantly they can't replicate the mile deep, soft , dark look you get with a wax. Some people like the shinier and more reflective look of sealants and don't see the look as a negative, others do.

FINALLY...you've got the category of products that are called coatings. The Modesta would fall into this category. Coatings came along a few years ago and were treated like snake oil at first, but have really proven to be legitimate products with great long lasting protection and the market for them has exploded. Coatings are essentially a very thin layer of additional paint coverage that heals as if it's another 2 or so microns of clear coat on the paint BUT having the protective properties of a wax or sealant. In some instances like the Modesta they even need to be cured with heat like you would bake a car after a paint job. Longevity claims for coatings are anywhere from 18 months to "lifetime". I had one of the original coatings on the market (Optimum Opti-coat) on my daily driver that sits outside 24/7 for 24 months before I sold it and only at the very end of that run was the protective properties starting to fade to where I was considering coating it again. Downside to coatings....well they are EXPENSIVE. Not just to buy but to apply as well. There needs to be care taken to make sure the car is meticulously prepped and free of anything on the surface to insure the coatings bond correctly in order to get the full life expectancy out of them. They can be finiky to work with, if you mess something up and get a streak or uneven application you have to polish the imperfection away with an abrasive polish, chemicals generally don't put a dent in them. Coatings also look and feel like bare paint. The newer ones seem to have picked up the game in the looks department esp the glass based ones like Modesta where they have properties much closer to a sealant looks wise. Finally they FEEL like bare paint on the surface too...grabby and not generally smooth.

**disclaimer** I've been out of the detailing industry for about 18 months now and have pretty well separated myself from it so some of this may be a touch outdated but for the most part hopefully it's helpful information.

globed

Thanks Andy, excellent reply. My bad, I do know the conceptual difference between wax, sealant, and coatings - but never worked with the stuff myself and have only had wax or sealant used on other cars. As mentioned, the car is white.

My guy raves about Modesto, so I poked around a bit and can't really understand the real world difference between BC-03 and the 'Dalton' special blend. Sounds like marketing BS, but I don't know.

Anyone else have a view on waxing vs coating? The idea of adhering a semi-permanent layer onto the car is both intriguing and worrisome.

Dan

mooty

audi on 19 is pretty accurate on those products.
however, some ppl claimes one cannot tell coating from wax? i guess either i need new glasses or others are blind. opti coat or nano coat for exaple, i can see streaks on them. and also a saran wrap sheen on it. on cars i really dont care about too much, my dually tow vehicle. i used opti coat. on p cars, it's always waxed.

NAM VET

for about 3 or 4 years my son and I have used the Blackfire products from Autogeek, which by the way has a lot of information on their web site about products and technique for cars. We use the sealants, Chris on his Lotus and Mini's and such, me on our white GT3 and our other cars. The key is always the preparation, ie, good wash, then clay, then polish with Menzerna, another Autogeek product, then the sealant, then keeping the cars spiffed up with Blackfire detailer and sealant spray, and washed as necessary.

The sealants are really easy to put on and wipe off, not like the old days of Simonize back in the '60's. You can do whole car in a half hour, on, let dry, wipe off. Pretty resistant to washing off as long as I use the appropriate wash products.

I know that some folks spend hours and hours using a multistep process like Zaino, and maybe on a dark car that sort of wax would make a difference, but I think on our lighter colored cars, and especially so on our white Porsche, the feel is silky smooth to my hand, and it really does look "wet."

I just have too much to do to spend hours every couple of weeks waxing, for us, the Blackfire (there are other good similar products from Autogeek) is just perfect.

One of my cars is a 12 year old X Jaguar, the AWD Sport Version, in platinum, which has spent much of its life sitting in the SC sun, and by now you would expect the finish to be quite faded and yet with my care, the paint looks like it came out of the factory last week.

Remember, you can re-coat sealants time and time again, and you can wax over and over, but once you put wax over sealant, you can't put sealant on over the wax. I am going to call Blackfire though, they have a new product which has both wax and sealant, and perhaps you can apply sealant over that product.

Car paint care is sort of like intimacy, it is all in the preparation.

All the best......

AudiOn19s

Dan - I'd go with your gut on which version of Modesta you choose if that's the path you go down.

Personally, like Mooty, I coat my daily drivers and use waxes or sealants on my toys. I do this because I actually enjoy the detailing process not really because of looks of product A vs. Product B...though I can tell the difference. If I had a toy that I didn't do a full detail on at least 2x a year I would probably go crazy. The thought of just doing maintenance washes and spot fixes for 2-3-4 years just doesn't appeal to me. If that's a huge selling point for you then the coatings are absolutely worth their weight in gold.

The reason I pointed out the white is because you'll see less of the positives vs. negatives of each product on a white car, it's beautiful and clean and shows off the lines of the car like no other but it's not a great canvas for showing off amazing detailing nor the visual benefits of some of these products.

globed

As always, you guys are great.

The gut has spoken, SwissVax it is. Couldn't get my head around adding semi-permanent layers... Maybe next go.

Off on a business trip to India, hopefully get down to Spain in a few weeks to see the shine.

Should feel better too... New front rotors, pads all around, front tires, spark plugs, oil, various filters, a warranty extension, and...... an empty wallet.

RAudi Driver

Sealants are very hard to apply correctly. There is a learning curve and you'll need a DA during this process to take off you mistakes.

Once correctly applied, they are awesome.

I've applied A Quartz to the NEW Q7. It was a bitch but I finally got the hang of it and it's working wonderful.

Good luck on whatever you do.

squid42

I bought the Opti gloss coat and the Opti seal since nobody could tell me the difference, exactly. I tried them out on a bass guitar body that is finished in automotive paint. I continued to scratch the body and do assorted other nastyness to it.

I think they are a bit overrated. The hardness might or might not be there but the implication (as I have perceived it) that there is any form of impact protection doesn't seem justified. They last a long time, water pearls off and cleaning them off light dirt gets a lot easier. I decided to put the gloss coat, the harder of the two, on wheels and on the side windows of my e89, the e89 which has an aerodynamics problem diverting dirty water onto the side window. Night and day difference.

The gloss coat is noticeably less glossy than the seal, and the seal feels smooth and slight and the coat does not. I can confirm that application issues with the coat are annoying, I had a few drops on the windshield and don't think I have been able to remove visible spots.

I did not cover the entire car yet but I think I'll do the seal, not the coat. As I said the coat is awesome on wheels (for cleaning) and on windows that don't have wipers.

Rick GT3

I had been detailing my own cars for more than 6 years and detailing the exterior can take me 2-3 days once I get home from work. Is time consuming and is better do it slowly and with patience. There's many good detailing forum/videos where everybody can learn and many great dproducts. My first car to detail was my black MB SL55 AMG many years ago (sold it over 2 years ago).

palm tree reflection on my SL55 trunk after being detailed

products that I usually use for car detailing, all products had been bought many times.