the_vetman

Disagree with some of the statements above. Bottom line: learn some god-damned track etiquette, learn to drive better, or do NOT put yourself in the "Advanced group"!!!

In PCA DEs, the importance of giving point-by's is discussed at each and every drivers meeting. As one Chief Instructor says, "If you see someone behind you, an alien ship didn't come by and drop it off. He's there for a reason - because he's faster than you. Give him the point-by!"

To someone who said the GT3 would've been on his bumper for 6 laps if he'd given a point-by, that's exactly the type of mentality this guy on the video has and exactly Joe's point. Clearly, you are unaware of what a well-driven Boxster Spyder can do on the track compared to a not well-driven GT3. Mid-engine cars can carry much more speed through the corners if you know what you're doing.

YES, Joe would've pulled away. Maybe not blow him out of the water and disappear, but would've clearly pulled away corner after corner. In fact, this is what I do to some/many GT3s and GT3 RSs. 9 seconds per lap. Hard data doesn't lie.

I do agree that getting closer will make it more obvious to give the point-by. Also agree that the speed differential will make it more obvious.

We're not talking about a situation where drivers with the exact same skill drive a GT3 vs. a Boxster. This particular GT3 driver was clearly slower. So give the god-damned point-by and stop ruining the fun for everyone else!!!

RSRanger

Just a few more thoughts and I'm done with this thread.
1. Some fault here lies on the organizing group and corner workers.
They should have been on top of this after a few times. Prob. this person
should not have been a solo driver?
2. This person I'm sure will now look in his mirrors.
3. OP you keep harping about how fast he should be b/c he has a 3.9L.
Please give it a rest or call Alex and get your own 3.9 and show us all
how you'll tear up the the track.
4. OP your comment, "why punish the victim" in my book truly blows.
"victim" really, this conveys to me you have no idea what that word
means. You diminish the significance of being a victim, please.
5. Finally you could have passed without a point by and later pleaded your
case to the officials just like you are doing here.

Enough ... OUT

Ranger (LRRP)

mooty

It's situational awareness.
if the car was not behind u and now he is, he's faster. stick the god damn finger out the fking window. nothing to do with what car u drive. I routinely point spec miatas by, that also means lift throttle and wait..

getting in the hot pit to ask for space doesn't work. I often will catch right up to the offending car.

it's important to pik the right organization to run with.

85Gold

Just to add my .02c I have a hard time pulling into the pits when this happens as I am sure he is going to pint me bye on the next straight. This was more prevalent when i was in the E36M3. When this happens to me and I also have faster cars behind me I will point them bye and hope the driver in front of me will get the idea. I hate holding up people and have the fastest arm in the East.

It isn't a crime to be slow, or I would be arrested long ago, but it is a crime to not have situational awareness when you are SOLO. I don't instruct much but that is one of my biggest criteria for moving somebody to solo.

Peter

orthojoe

You're not getting it. I don't think anybody here will deny that a 3.9L GT3 is faster than a boxster spyder. Nobody. I'm just stating a fact. Unfortunately, the guy seems to think that having a faster car makes him automatically faster. This is an incorrect assumption which led to discouteous behavior. You don't see that?

What would you call it then? Perhaps it's a strong word, but applicable nonetheless. Obviously there are more heinous acts out there to commit than refusing to point someone by, but you seem more interested in protecting a fellow 3.9er than agreeing to common courtesy.


I hope you realize why that is a VERY bad idea on so many different levels. I'm not interested in crashing my car or or his. Remind me not to drive slower than you since you seem to think disregarding rules and safety is a good idea. That's a great way to make enemies and get yourself thrown out.

Coochas

Personally, I would NEVER create and publicly post such a video. I just don't have the frat-boy or mean girl trait.

My guess is that if this was a PCA event and the organizers found out about this video that the creator would be barred from future participation. The words "in the spirit of" would likely be used. An example of this is the PCA National policy which prohibits the distribution of pics/video involving accidents at PCA events without expressed permission of the owner. I think whoever organized this particular track event would not be pleased with this video.

My advice to the OP would be to lock this thread and hope it fades away quickly.

Carrera GT

In the beginning of the video the 3.9 had traffic. I didn't see a flag. I didn't see the Boxster even once get into range to make a pass other than under brakes. This is a point-n-squirt vs momentum ... a story as old as the hills ... the former will say "who?" and the latter will cry "me!"

It looked like an HOD day. Dave does things well, but maybe it was another operator. The Thunderhill corner workers are maybe relaxed, but they're not so negligent as to let a car circulate three laps without someone getting on the radio. The only radio I imagine would have been "watch the guy in the Boxster, he's shaking his hand or something."

As for hot pit to cool off. If a driver is 15 seconds faster than another driver for a 2:00 lap, the math is pretty simple. 8 laps to catch up. Give or take. 16 minutes optimum. Give or take the time to get on track, warm up, flag and cool down, that's a whole session, assuming nothing else slows down either car. At least half a session of clear sailing for the price of letting tire temps down a couple of degrees. I do this quite often and it invariably gets a "I'll put you out in front of the train" helping hand from the starter, especially at Sears, where it can be really hard to get clear track. Even if I'm 30 seconds faster than the train and the train is 30 seconds "long" that's still a warm-up lap, a hot lap and a "dammit!" lap. Still better than sitting behind someone and better than passing someone with tunnel vision and who knows what else going wrong in their cabin. Once you're in a muddle of "I'm so much faster than this idiot in front of me!" drivers, the only exit is the pit or the wall.

orthojoe

Agree that David runs a good program. He was there. He knows about the scenario, and admits the flag workers dropped the ball and admits they have a tough time with them sometimes. I had hoped my hand waving at the flag posts would have been noticed and they would have done something thing, but alas, that did not occur. They really did fall asleep.

OK. This is really getting nowhere. We've all made our point. I'm sure the 3.9 guy has seen everything by now and gets it. Mods, please close this thread.

Carrera GT

This is a great way to go. I much rather practice line and apex speed (fall back 50 car lengths on the straight, pick up to flanking speed just in time to peak at the brake marker, gather up the slow poke right at the apex and give him a mirror full of "where did that come from?" Rinse and repeat. Once another car catches us, I sit on the line at the pace of the slower car in front, which gives the driver behind time to scope the situation, then I point-by and let the other driver do the work of waking up sleeping beauty.

Chris R.

Punish the victim? Come on man....he was annoying by not letting you pass but don't be just as annoying by saying stuff like that.
You want to pass? Come racing.

996FLT6

U see this on the streets all the time. You can't fight every one of those guys out there. Redmist/road rage all the same. Not worth bursting a blood vessel for. Just go back to pregrid report it and get back on track. If it happens to quite a few people just like u- u get enuf reports- the guy will warned. Mike

orthojoe

I'm not good enough to race. Never will be. Not sure why you guys are so fixated on the word victim. I'm no english major. Pick a better word for me. You know what I was trying to say.

Again, agree, agree, and was done. Not mad. I did have fun making the video and wanted to share it.