What goes around ... wheels for a centerlock RS ... O.Z. Superforgiata Centerlock
12-30-2011, 02:04 AM
#91
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The problem is the very design on the centerlock hub, but the symptom is that the splines would not extend fully into the center of the wheel (and be "flush" with the outer edge of the wheel when properly secured to the axle hub.)
The problem, I dunno, but that's the symptom.
I think the problem is that the original 500nm torque spec allowed all four wheels to rotate on the hub until the splines were binding. Here's my bone of contention with Mr Porsche -- the splines are a safety mechanism and absolutely, positively not part of the mechanism designed to secure the wheel, only to act as a fail safe mechanism in the event of failure in the assembly itself or in the installation of the wheel. The wheel is secured to the hub by friction between the nut, the wheel and the axle hub. Nothing else. Not even the locating dowel pins (red alloy suckers ... these serve only to local and align the wheel centered on the centerlock hub.) The pins are flimsy little things and are to be replaced if they show any signs of wear (beyond the wear and tear of installing the wheels.) So the safety mechanism was keeping the wheel on the car -- that means the design is fundamentally flawed (at 500nm) and that, to this little, black duck, suggests the design itself must be reviewed and revised.
This is one of the insanity cases of the US DOT, I suspect. If the centerlocks on the Porsche race cars have done good service and are basically never the cause of a car losing a race, despite torturous race conditions, then they're probably not too bad for a whip along the street to the corner store for some coffee and a few vegetables. Why change? Why fix what ain't broke? Was it a manufacturing issue (cost of materials, certification across multiple new countries and markets, etc.) or was it a deliberate "non reverse compatible" issue to prevent people mounting race wheels on street cars or being sure of third party channel and product line revenue by preventing retail customers from sourcing outside the intended wheel vendors? (yes, all these decisions come into product plans ... I lived in this world for a career spanning three decades of this nonsense ...)
The problem, I dunno, but that's the symptom.
I think the problem is that the original 500nm torque spec allowed all four wheels to rotate on the hub until the splines were binding. Here's my bone of contention with Mr Porsche -- the splines are a safety mechanism and absolutely, positively not part of the mechanism designed to secure the wheel, only to act as a fail safe mechanism in the event of failure in the assembly itself or in the installation of the wheel. The wheel is secured to the hub by friction between the nut, the wheel and the axle hub. Nothing else. Not even the locating dowel pins (red alloy suckers ... these serve only to local and align the wheel centered on the centerlock hub.) The pins are flimsy little things and are to be replaced if they show any signs of wear (beyond the wear and tear of installing the wheels.) So the safety mechanism was keeping the wheel on the car -- that means the design is fundamentally flawed (at 500nm) and that, to this little, black duck, suggests the design itself must be reviewed and revised.
This is one of the insanity cases of the US DOT, I suspect. If the centerlocks on the Porsche race cars have done good service and are basically never the cause of a car losing a race, despite torturous race conditions, then they're probably not too bad for a whip along the street to the corner store for some coffee and a few vegetables. Why change? Why fix what ain't broke? Was it a manufacturing issue (cost of materials, certification across multiple new countries and markets, etc.) or was it a deliberate "non reverse compatible" issue to prevent people mounting race wheels on street cars or being sure of third party channel and product line revenue by preventing retail customers from sourcing outside the intended wheel vendors? (yes, all these decisions come into product plans ... I lived in this world for a career spanning three decades of this nonsense ...)
12-30-2011, 02:11 AM
#92
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This is one of the insanity cases of the US DOT, I suspect. If the centerlocks on the Porsche race cars have done good service and are basically never the cause of a car losing a race, despite torturous race conditions, then they're probably not too bad for a whip along the street to the corner store for some coffee and a few vegetables. Why change? Why fix what ain't broke? Was it a manufacturing issue (cost of materials, certification across multiple new countries and markets, etc.) or was it a deliberate "non reverse compatible" issue to prevent people mounting race wheels on street cars or being sure of third party channel and product line revenue by preventing retail customers from sourcing outside the intended wheel vendors? (yes, all these decisions come into product plans ... I lived in this world for a career spanning three decades of this nonsense ...)
invent and reinvent.
and reinvent again only to realize we come full circle.
soon we will be using vinyl lp again and vacuum tubes will be main stream
12-30-2011, 02:14 AM
#93
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great thread, so which is it then? The bbs with the cup CL system then
I think it's a cost cutting marketing sceme. Surly things like, not welding in the coolent flanges, cheep ims bearings and poorly designed CL will begin to destroy a brand overtime!?!!?
interested to see where the whole CL thing goes over time.
I think it's a cost cutting marketing sceme. Surly things like, not welding in the coolent flanges, cheep ims bearings and poorly designed CL will begin to destroy a brand overtime!?!!?
interested to see where the whole CL thing goes over time.
12-30-2011, 10:26 AM
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12-30-2011, 11:14 AM
#95
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^ NO. you are just insane.
save the money, leave the LP and VPI alone ( i thought they were gone until i saw them on absolute sound last month, and OMG oracle still alive, though well tempered died. ) and buy a GT3. you can't drive the VPI all that fast!
save the money, leave the LP and VPI alone ( i thought they were gone until i saw them on absolute sound last month, and OMG oracle still alive, though well tempered died. ) and buy a GT3. you can't drive the VPI all that fast!
12-30-2011, 11:37 AM
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haha too late. the vpi sounds beautiful with the shelter 501. i am in heaven every nite i come home from work, and it's not even run in yet. fremer been raving about it too in s/phile. also, 30 watts class a is enough juice for the m/l's.
anyway, system is finished, i'm pretty much content with it, believe it, or not..........ok maybe just some cables gonna be changed and isolation devices added. still using a 15 year old digital front-end which works just fine at 44.1khz!
needed to get this out of the way first, as music is very important to me. gt3 or cayman r is next however long it takes..........
anyway, system is finished, i'm pretty much content with it, believe it, or not..........ok maybe just some cables gonna be changed and isolation devices added. still using a 15 year old digital front-end which works just fine at 44.1khz!
needed to get this out of the way first, as music is very important to me. gt3 or cayman r is next however long it takes..........
12-30-2011, 11:49 AM
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actually, the matriach of the weisfield family ( harry's wife ) died last week, r.i.p.
bought the 16.5 vacuum cleaner as well. can't use it at nite though, it's louder than sharky bypass!
bought the 16.5 vacuum cleaner as well. can't use it at nite though, it's louder than sharky bypass!
