jlr

I am currently thinking about changing from PCCBs to steel brakes on my 2011 GT3 due to what seems like an incurable mushy feel on the street. I've not driven a .2 GT3 with the OEM steel brakes, and would really like to do so before spending the money on the change. I'm leaning towards the OEM brakes, but would consider aftermarket rotors if I liked the feel. If anyone in the Birmingham AL w/ a .2 GT3 and steel brakes would terribly mind giving me a few minutes to assess the feel, I would be very appreciative.

TRAKCAR

Does not sound right! I thought PCCB always felt solid?

jlr

Other folks have expressed a similar opinion re the PCCBs -- to me it is probably more accurate to say there is a soft pedal travel that precedes a solid on/off feel. Definitely different than other P car brakes I've experienced, not squishy but not positive under foot either. Don't like it at all.

I'm having another flush with Motul tomorrow to be sure there is no air and to try a different fluid. BTW, the Endless fluid feels slightly better than the stock fluid to me.

brim

My PCCBs have never had a mushy feel at all...they are almost too hard to drive on the street. Get 'em checked out if the flush doesn't help.

jlr

As you know, a lot of it is subjective, what you are used to, what your expectations are, etc. I could see someone saying my brakes are fine. The independent mechanic I use, who is also a friend, says he can't really tell they are mushy. The dealership, however, thought they were a tad mushy. A lot depends on temperature and use. I like firmness, even sitting in rush hour traffic, so they are soft to me.

sin911

OEM fluid is crap, Motul should feel a lot better.

Did you check the pad condition as well? I don't mean to preach or anything, it just sounds strange.

997gt3north

If you search some of my old posts on ceramics and how the 'feel' changes once they have been 'birthed' at the track - this may be what you are 'feeling'.

Summary
- When you first get new ceramics, they have an extremely high pedal engagement point with an extreme on/off feel that I would describe as the opposite of mushy - I remember the feeling myself, it is an almost OMG I can't believe these brakes - they must be worth $8k feel.
- Then, after birth by 1000C fire at your 1st or 2nd trackday, that feeling goes away - and, as you pointed out, in your mind you know something has changed - you tell the tech, they tell you nothing is wrong - but you know you are right and they are wrong.
- The benefit of the new 'softer' feel is that H/T is now a breeze - you still miss that virgin rock hard 'feel' - it will not come back
- Definitely replace the stock fluid as it will firm things up about 20% (Viagra) - but, you are only a virgin once
- As time passes, you will forget that feeling

What I believe has actually happened is that the manufacturing process of the rotors produces a slightly ruff outer surface of the rotor which initially results in the very high engagement point and razor on/off feel has now been 'sanded' smoother by the pads - after which the thermal properties of the pads and rotors are able to do the job that they are designed to do whereas originally some of the stopping was actually being done by the friction of the rotor.

I could be wrong, but that is what I have put together after my research.

jlr

Yes, indeed, I noticed the change after my first track day, thought I'd boiled the fluid and introduced air. Later, had the brakes flushed and fluid replaced with Endless, which as I said, is a bit better. Today I'm going to try Motul and see if that helps. I'm not optimistic that different fluid will help much that regular driving temperatures.