How "good" is OEM roll cage
#16
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Mikymu all I can say in thE forum is that carbon cages won’t pass any of the tests for cages, and to give you an example that is based on actual events let’s say you roll over with the carbon cage and on the first impact the roof doesn’t collapse. If the car stops rolling you are ok if it continuous to roll you are not because the cage won’t be there no more. It has been destroyed to little pieces in the first impact doing its job once and now you are rolling without one.
And for the bolted vs. welded here is a picture from 997rs with rohlr driving.
If dmbs AND FIA accept the OEM Porsche cage with bolts i don't see why we shouldn't.
Also two abstracts from adac 24h regulations that are self explanatory.
John
And for the bolted vs. welded here is a picture from 997rs with rohlr driving.
If dmbs AND FIA accept the OEM Porsche cage with bolts i don't see why we shouldn't.
Also two abstracts from adac 24h regulations that are self explanatory.
John
Thanks for the info John. Very useful. CF roll cage is not a viable solution. Now I need to figure out how to incorporate a knee bar on OEM roll cage - it will have to be bolt on and not intrude the driver space. It's going to be challenging for sure to come up with a solution
#17
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mikymu,
Ask FRIZ here on rennlist if the OEM roll bar works...he has some first hand experience...best described as full, full, nose-to-tail full, then a round-off....and then nailed the landing...video is still out there somewhere on youtube...scary ****
What'd you get FRIZ, cut nose, sore ribs, sore shoulders?? without OEM rollbar, belts, seats and helmet it would have been UGLY...
Ask FRIZ here on rennlist if the OEM roll bar works...he has some first hand experience...best described as full, full, nose-to-tail full, then a round-off....and then nailed the landing...video is still out there somewhere on youtube...scary ****
What'd you get FRIZ, cut nose, sore ribs, sore shoulders?? without OEM rollbar, belts, seats and helmet it would have been UGLY...
This is the question I ask myself when it comes to roll cage selection: Which chassis would you strap yourself into if it roll off a rocky cliff and land at 125 mph? Fashion statement don't have my vote
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Thanks for the info John. Very useful. CF roll cage is not a viable solution. Now I need to figure out how to incorporate a knee bar on OEM roll cage - it will have to be bolt on and not intrude the driver space. It's going to be challenging for sure to come up with a solution
About knee bar I would say you are going too far with it the a pillar sides of 997 are far stronger than the 964s but me likes going too far so you can buy a fia approved bar and attachment points and build one removable all you need is a good welder.
I am planning to do a DIY of some kind (you are far better in DIY posts and you have purple gloves too) for installing side door bars on the oem cage of 996.
Good luck with the built.
John
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Glad I talked you out of the Carbon Cage.
About knee bar I would say you are going too far with it the a pillar sides of 997 are far stronger than the 964s but me likes going too far so you can buy a fia approved bar and attachment points and build one removable all you need is a good welder.
I am planning to do a DIY of some kind (you are far better in DIY posts and you have purple gloves too) for installing side door bars on the oem cage of 996.
Good luck with the built.
John
About knee bar I would say you are going too far with it the a pillar sides of 997 are far stronger than the 964s but me likes going too far so you can buy a fia approved bar and attachment points and build one removable all you need is a good welder.
I am planning to do a DIY of some kind (you are far better in DIY posts and you have purple gloves too) for installing side door bars on the oem cage of 996.
Good luck with the built.
John
I hope not ... knee bar is a must in my book
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Europe FIA standard are what the OEM bolt-in cage is based on.
However in USA, groups such as SCCA decided on a material that happens to be thicker than what FIA requires.
Thus north americans assume the OEM cage is not as good as larger tubed cages.
it is a misconception.
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the carbon cage concept is great, however the anti-splinter technology is not yet approved in north america or FIA i believe......
nobody wants to pick shards of carbon from the back of their head.......
The knee bar is another SCCA etc rule...... funny that CUP cars dont have em'.......
i was told that the 997 tub has enough support without knee bar.......
nobody wants to pick shards of carbon from the back of their head.......
The knee bar is another SCCA etc rule...... funny that CUP cars dont have em'.......
i was told that the 997 tub has enough support without knee bar.......
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the carbon cage concept is great, however the anti-splinter technology is not yet approved in north america or FIA i believe......
nobody wants to pick shards of carbon from the back of their head.......
The knee bar is another SCCA etc rule...... funny that CUP cars dont have em'.......
i was told that the 997 tub has enough support without knee bar.......
nobody wants to pick shards of carbon from the back of their head.......
The knee bar is another SCCA etc rule...... funny that CUP cars dont have em'.......
i was told that the 997 tub has enough support without knee bar.......
Love their roll cage and he did a great job on mooty's 6 Gt3
#25
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off topic: i love cup car interior. i really wish rs was closer to this than street 911. those are proper door pulls. i want toggle switches in rs too. no doubt about what is on or off.
on topic: let me know if you go with oem clubsport bar (rear and/or front piece). i can at least help out with getting a set from germany if you can't locate in US. i'm waiting on Manthey to figure out how to install the rear portion. the wait is killing me! this beautiful bar is just sitting at the dealership for 2 weeks now!
on topic: let me know if you go with oem clubsport bar (rear and/or front piece). i can at least help out with getting a set from germany if you can't locate in US. i'm waiting on Manthey to figure out how to install the rear portion. the wait is killing me! this beautiful bar is just sitting at the dealership for 2 weeks now!
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Europe and USA are where this comes into play.
Europe FIA standard are what the OEM bolt-in cage is based on.
However in USA, groups such as SCCA decided on a material that happens to be thicker than what FIA requires.
Thus north americans assume the OEM cage is not as good as larger tubed cages.
it is a misconception.
Europe FIA standard are what the OEM bolt-in cage is based on.
However in USA, groups such as SCCA decided on a material that happens to be thicker than what FIA requires.
Thus north americans assume the OEM cage is not as good as larger tubed cages.
it is a misconception.
FIA approved cages are welcome in SCCA.
John
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#29
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Europe and USA are where this comes into play.
Europe FIA standard are what the OEM bolt-in cage is based on.
However in USA, groups such as SCCA decided on a material that happens to be thicker than what FIA requires.
Thus north americans assume the OEM cage is not as good as larger tubed cages.
it is a misconception.
Europe FIA standard are what the OEM bolt-in cage is based on.
However in USA, groups such as SCCA decided on a material that happens to be thicker than what FIA requires.
Thus north americans assume the OEM cage is not as good as larger tubed cages.
it is a misconception.
Now, a related question. Several others have observed that the OEM bar limits the seat travel, so that if you are tall, the bar interferes with your driving position (recognizing that on the track, you probably want to move your seat closer to the steering wheel to allow more control and better heel/toe, but I want to preserve the streetability of the car regardless).
I plan on putting a roll bar and seats in the car this winter, so I starting the research now.
Thanks.
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Thanks guys. I appreciate the insight.
Now, a related question. Several others have observed that the OEM bar limits the seat travel, so that if you are tall, the bar interferes with your driving position (recognizing that on the track, you probably want to move your seat closer to the steering wheel to allow more control and better heel/toe, but I want to preserve the streetability of the car regardless).
I plan on putting a roll bar and seats in the car this winter, so I starting the research now.
Thanks.
Now, a related question. Several others have observed that the OEM bar limits the seat travel, so that if you are tall, the bar interferes with your driving position (recognizing that on the track, you probably want to move your seat closer to the steering wheel to allow more control and better heel/toe, but I want to preserve the streetability of the car regardless).
I plan on putting a roll bar and seats in the car this winter, so I starting the research now.
Thanks.
in a 997.1 the sport seats and GT2 seats both go all the way back with OEM clubsport bar. They do slightly touch all the way back, but go back none the less.
anybody here drive with seat all the way back to max distance??
Last edited by tcsracing1; 07-17-2010 at 01:03 AM.