What's my RS worth?? not selling; just curious..
11-03-2008, 12:48 AM
#46
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If you sell it for below fair market value a sharp attorney will allocate the fair value to it despite your sale.
If you are planning to keep the car than you are looking for an agreed value based on current market conditions for a forced sale. Thus the value could easily be argued to be about 20% below MSRP. You are going to be able to use some negotiation, if they think you are not desperate to keep it.
I don't know how old your son is, but perhaps you simply sell it and then buy one later and he does not need to know it is sold.
Do not try to sell it for super cheap to a buddy and then buy it back. this can have bad results for both party I have seen it. Simply be straight up. You are probably going to lose 50% minus Attorney costs. Get it over ASAP. you and your wife and your child will benefit.
Again if you wish to keep it, agree on a value at about 20% discount to MSRP which is realistic for a forced quick sale in this enviroment with all transaction costs included.
I hope this helps. I feel for you. There are no winners except for the attorneys if this gets dragged out. Move on as quickly as possible. I am talking from experience of helping about 4-5 couples a year.
If you are planning to keep the car than you are looking for an agreed value based on current market conditions for a forced sale. Thus the value could easily be argued to be about 20% below MSRP. You are going to be able to use some negotiation, if they think you are not desperate to keep it.
I don't know how old your son is, but perhaps you simply sell it and then buy one later and he does not need to know it is sold.
Do not try to sell it for super cheap to a buddy and then buy it back. this can have bad results for both party I have seen it. Simply be straight up. You are probably going to lose 50% minus Attorney costs. Get it over ASAP. you and your wife and your child will benefit.
Again if you wish to keep it, agree on a value at about 20% discount to MSRP which is realistic for a forced quick sale in this enviroment with all transaction costs included.
I hope this helps. I feel for you. There are no winners except for the attorneys if this gets dragged out. Move on as quickly as possible. I am talking from experience of helping about 4-5 couples a year.
11-03-2008, 01:06 AM
#47
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Do not try to sell it for super cheap to a buddy and then buy it back. this can have bad results for both party I have seen it
what Leif was doing.
Just curious I have no idea but nothing lawyer do surprises me anymore
See 9th circuit court of appeals. Which we Californians are going to slam dunk on Nov 4.
11-03-2008, 10:18 AM
#48
Nordschleife Master
If you sell it for below fair market value a sharp attorney will allocate the fair value to it despite your sale.
If you are planning to keep the car than you are looking for an agreed value based on current market conditions for a forced sale. Thus the value could easily be argued to be about 20% below MSRP. You are going to be able to use some negotiation, if they think you are not desperate to keep it.
I don't know how old your son is, but perhaps you simply sell it and then buy one later and he does not need to know it is sold.
Do not try to sell it for super cheap to a buddy and then buy it back. this can have bad results for both party I have seen it. Simply be straight up. You are probably going to lose 50% minus Attorney costs. Get it over ASAP. you and your wife and your child will benefit.
Again if you wish to keep it, agree on a value at about 20% discount to MSRP which is realistic for a forced quick sale in this enviroment with all transaction costs included.
I hope this helps. I feel for you. There are no winners except for the attorneys if this gets dragged out. Move on as quickly as possible. I am talking from experience of helping about 4-5 couples a year.
If you are planning to keep the car than you are looking for an agreed value based on current market conditions for a forced sale. Thus the value could easily be argued to be about 20% below MSRP. You are going to be able to use some negotiation, if they think you are not desperate to keep it.
I don't know how old your son is, but perhaps you simply sell it and then buy one later and he does not need to know it is sold.
Do not try to sell it for super cheap to a buddy and then buy it back. this can have bad results for both party I have seen it. Simply be straight up. You are probably going to lose 50% minus Attorney costs. Get it over ASAP. you and your wife and your child will benefit.
Again if you wish to keep it, agree on a value at about 20% discount to MSRP which is realistic for a forced quick sale in this enviroment with all transaction costs included.
I hope this helps. I feel for you. There are no winners except for the attorneys if this gets dragged out. Move on as quickly as possible. I am talking from experience of helping about 4-5 couples a year.
The trick is to dump it before the counting begins
Oh, in my state he can count on losing closer to 70% PLUS fees!
11-03-2008, 10:25 AM
#49
Nordschleife Master
Yes, I am familiar with the expression. It's just that it is not only Medically incorrect, it is senseless as written. Think about it. You're defining slow learning, which is quite different from insane.
Insanity, in a Medical sense is a complex definition. Even in a practical sense it isn't that. However, sometimes insane folks perform repetitive behaviors ,but they do not expect different outcomes, it's just OCB.
Aphorisms are not, by their very existence, necessarily correct. The first time I heard that was on one of those stupid cop TV shows.
Insanity, in a Medical sense is a complex definition. Even in a practical sense it isn't that. However, sometimes insane folks perform repetitive behaviors ,but they do not expect different outcomes, it's just OCB.
Aphorisms are not, by their very existence, necessarily correct. The first time I heard that was on one of those stupid cop TV shows.
Last edited by allegretto; 11-03-2008 at 02:34 PM.
11-03-2008, 10:31 AM
#50
Nordschleife Master
To paraphrase de Tocqueville, once the welfare recipients discover that they can vote their welfare from the Public Treasury, the first thing they vote for is more welfare.
Get ready...
11-03-2008, 06:34 PM
#51
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What Snowboarder said could, in practice, work even better if you were to rent the vehicles as part of an arrive and drive business for a token fee. That way the only thing your ex would be entitled to would be her share of the "profits"; which as we all know can equal just about anything you want to show. You could even be at the track driving the cars yourself and there would'nt be a fuggin thing the ex could do. Trust me, you've got to start thinking this way, and fast. Stack the deck in your favor now while you are still married. Transfer those titles over to a business. It's all about the status-quo at the time of the divorce.
11-04-2008, 12:29 AM
#53
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Elaborate? How can the buying party get in trouble for that and while your at it how to the opposing counsel argue intent?
Paul the buying party is just potentially hurt by paying taxes and fees and if something happens to the car. The seller as someone else mentioned, will have the Fair Market Value assigned to the car anyway. But as another poster mentioned, if counting hasn't begun and "intent" is not proven then great. Another but is that sometimes the buyer doesn't want to give back a car he bought at a really cheap price... and the seller wants it back. Also the state of ? could tax it at what they deem fair value also. Just be careful. I can't give any more detail, except to stay be careful.
I hope it all works out. Hey I would love to buy an RS for 50k!
Paul the buying party is just potentially hurt by paying taxes and fees and if something happens to the car. The seller as someone else mentioned, will have the Fair Market Value assigned to the car anyway. But as another poster mentioned, if counting hasn't begun and "intent" is not proven then great. Another but is that sometimes the buyer doesn't want to give back a car he bought at a really cheap price... and the seller wants it back. Also the state of ? could tax it at what they deem fair value also. Just be careful. I can't give any more detail, except to stay be careful.
I hope it all works out. Hey I would love to buy an RS for 50k!
11-04-2008, 01:22 PM
#55
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
What Snowboarder said could, in practice, work even better if you were to rent the vehicles as part of an arrive and drive business for a token fee. That way the only thing your ex would be entitled to would be her share of the "profits"; which as we all know can equal just about anything you want to show. You could even be at the track driving the cars yourself and there would'nt be a fuggin thing the ex could do. Trust me, you've got to start thinking this way, and fast. Stack the deck in your favor now while you are still married. Transfer those titles over to a business. It's all about the status-quo at the time of the divorce.
11-04-2008, 02:53 PM
#56
Nordschleife Master
Time actually works against you, not for you. Here's why;
It will be years till it get's to the judge. The judge has a busy schedule and unless your case is very interesting (lots and lots of $$$) they've heard it all before and about all that will matter is are either of you likely to kill the children and what is left to divide. Indiscretions committed literally years ago won't be as important. And it doesn't seem like they've begun the evaluation.
Expect her lawyer to make threats, and yours to say "don't do that again". But as always, it's much better to ask forgivness than permission. From your sig I think you already know that.
Either way, you pay. The only thing you can impact is "how much". Yes, a forensic accountant, hell an idiot can tell what it's "worth". And they'll have no problem telling you to sell the assets, even if you are "renting" them. Make it disappear now and they will stamp their feet, but not much else to do. If you go absolutely crazy and sell too much they may try for a Restraining Order, but again, don't go crazy, go smart.
If you think what you're doing is bad, wait till you see what her atty is gonna tell her to do. It's all a very asymmetric rip-off in the end.
11-04-2008, 05:28 PM
#57
Rennlist Member
they will continue to drag their feet, but their meter will move along smartly, just watch.
Time actually works against you, not for you. Here's why;
It will be years till it get's to the judge. The judge has a busy schedule and unless your case is very interesting (lots and lots of $$$) they've heard it all before and about all that will matter is are either of you likely to kill the children and what is left to divide. Indiscretions committed literally years ago won't be as important. And it doesn't seem like they've begun the evaluation.
Expect her lawyer to make threats, and yours to say "don't do that again". But as always, it's much better to ask forgivness than permission. From your sig I think you already know that.
Either way, you pay. The only thing you can impact is "how much". Yes, a forensic accountant, hell an idiot can tell what it's "worth". And they'll have no problem telling you to sell the assets, even if you are "renting" them. Make it disappear now and they will stamp their feet, but not much else to do. If you go absolutely crazy and sell too much they may try for a Restraining Order, but again, don't go crazy, go smart.
If you think what you're doing is bad, wait till you see what her atty is gonna tell her to do. It's all a very asymmetric rip-off in the end.
Time actually works against you, not for you. Here's why;
It will be years till it get's to the judge. The judge has a busy schedule and unless your case is very interesting (lots and lots of $$$) they've heard it all before and about all that will matter is are either of you likely to kill the children and what is left to divide. Indiscretions committed literally years ago won't be as important. And it doesn't seem like they've begun the evaluation.
Expect her lawyer to make threats, and yours to say "don't do that again". But as always, it's much better to ask forgivness than permission. From your sig I think you already know that.
Either way, you pay. The only thing you can impact is "how much". Yes, a forensic accountant, hell an idiot can tell what it's "worth". And they'll have no problem telling you to sell the assets, even if you are "renting" them. Make it disappear now and they will stamp their feet, but not much else to do. If you go absolutely crazy and sell too much they may try for a Restraining Order, but again, don't go crazy, go smart.
If you think what you're doing is bad, wait till you see what her atty is gonna tell her to do. It's all a very asymmetric rip-off in the end.
11-04-2008, 06:44 PM
#58
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If you are worried about the breadcrumb trail, have a buddy set up his own holding company and transfer the assets of your company to his company with an explicit arrangement for use by you contained IN THE OPERATING AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE TWO COMPANIES, which you do not have to show to anyone, including an accountant or the court. They will see that assets have been transferred at a certain value, that is all.
11-04-2008, 07:57 PM
#59
you guys are making me want to sell all my stuff, horde my money, snag the kids, leave my wife and go hide in the Montana mountains....
and shiat, I'm happily married...
sorry leif to hear what your going through and what's ahead...
and shiat, I'm happily married...
sorry leif to hear what your going through and what's ahead...
