Bruce In Philly

I like this engineer blogger... I suspect most of you have seen one or two of his vids....

Well he must be getting popular because Michelin invited him out to check out the 4S tires. A good vid, but what really struck me is the real-time empirical evidence of braking performance deep into vid.... at 8:09, shows the actual braking performance for all the autocross participants..... the Michelins were far superior. Also, I am impressed that Michelin really chose to test against the real alternatives to their new tire: S04, Pirelli, Conti, Goodyear.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

The Ox

Thanks Bruce, good info.

Ruskiy

The Continental ExtremeContact SPORT is something I am leaning more towards now based on these reviews, but when the time comes to buy I'll make a decision then. Seems like Conti SPORT are an improvement over PSS yet sharper handling than the PS4S tires, so they fit well right between the PSS and PS4S models. Also, the wear is 340 on Conti vs 300 Michelins, but these days they say wear figures don't mean all that much.

Bruce In Philly

Update after about 2 months of heavy highway and street use.... 2009 C2S daily driver.

I am liking these Michelins more and more... but... I still feel they are mushyer than my PSSs and.... they don't seem to track straight at really fast highway speeds.... the car seems to wander a bit. So... I had an alignment done .... nothing too out of spec... my usual where I have a tiny bit more negative camber added in the front and most of the negative camber removed in the rear. This is virutally the same alignment I had with my PSSs....... and car just seems to wander a bit with these new Michelins.

Beyond that above, the tires just grip way more than the PSSs did in just about every condition including cold tires.... they also seem to be more quiet although that is a tough call as my PSSs were pretty worn out in the end. (BTW, I have always found Michelin to make a quiet tire... all I have owned from them were really quiet.)

I still feel that maybe I should have ordered the PSSs which are still on the market..... tough to argue with more grip as they are safer.... I dunno.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

ADias

No negative camber in a 911 makes no sense. Did you meant instead that you removed most of the toe-in in the rear?

stronbl

Thanks for the update Bruce. Based on your feedback and from others earlier in the thread, my conclusion, and assuming one is into Michelins and can find a set (of 4) MPSS, is get them while still available as they are currently less expensive than MP 4S. At least that is the direction I'm headed ... but good to know the MP 4S is fine too.

Bruce In Philly

My objective is to limit inner wear.... there is a ton written about this.... it's like an oil thread. I get inner rear wear even after a spec alignment.... I choose to take out most of this negative camber in the belief that will get less inner wear and longer tire life. With my chosen alignments, I get less inner wear.

Am I deluded? Is the toe adjustment really the reason I am getting less wear? Maybe, but my experience tells me to take most of that negative rear camber out.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

Mumbles

What I personally found out about PSS tires is that there's a fair bit more road noise V OEM PS2. Interesting to find out about handling and noise with these new 4S

Bruce In Philly

Having written these comments... YMMV ... tires can be like oil. They are my opinions... I highly recommend you seek out others. Apparently, from what I read, I appear to be unique in my observations.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

Wayne Smith

While it seems like camber would create edge wear, on our cars, assuming you don't run the values to extremes, it is the toe in that rips up the inner edge.

ADias

No Bruce, it's not the rear negative camber that causes inner tire wear; it is the high toe-in. Minimize that and your rear inner wear is gone.

A proper street alignment is factory spec throughout with the exception of rear toe-in which should be minimized. What you have now does not surprise me to cause what you describe.

Cautionary note: the factory sets large toe-in to keep the car 'ultra' safe for hot-headed drivers who do not understand 911 dynamics. A high toe-in in the rear leads to more understeer. Less toe-in, less understeer, less inner wear. But... with less understeer, be prepared to deal with 911 dynamics (still present in a 997 - especially a rear-driven one).

Byprodriver

Good test of MSS & MPS4 in Grassroots Motorsports June issue.

Mumbles

I truly believe that to retain the handling and ride of this car as it was engineered, OEM tires are the way to go. Yes the rear tires wear quickly but for me that's part and parcel of the cars ability to point and shoot.

Bomar Shelby

Boo, hiss, they don't make the PS4 for my 20 inch Champion wheels

z3mcoupe

I kinda feel the same way. Of course I've no proof to back it up, but knowing the miles of testing racked up on the OEM tires, it just makes me sleep better at night lol