Excellence Magazine Gets Some Sack: 997 More Involving Than 991
04-27-2012 | 08:29 PM
#31
Nordschleife Master
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 8,313
Likes: 402
From: Southwest
No, but they ar Porsche fans like me... so they know what they are talking about. 
P.S. - A lot of talk about Carreras and GT3s being so different. Yes, GT3s have (so far) some higher performance race-tested parts and for heavy trackers it does make sense to consider those. However, Carreras are perfectly reliable cars for road use and occasional track use. Tracked cars no matter what model will wear faster and break faster - GT3s' maintenance is commensurately higher priced too.
Talk about Aisin gearboxes... what's wrong with that? 996s and current GT3 have Getrags or perhaps ZF. The 997.2 PDK is ZF. The word is that the 991 7sp and PDK are Aisin.
P.S. - A lot of talk about Carreras and GT3s being so different. Yes, GT3s have (so far) some higher performance race-tested parts and for heavy trackers it does make sense to consider those. However, Carreras are perfectly reliable cars for road use and occasional track use. Tracked cars no matter what model will wear faster and break faster - GT3s' maintenance is commensurately higher priced too.
Talk about Aisin gearboxes... what's wrong with that? 996s and current GT3 have Getrags or perhaps ZF. The 997.2 PDK is ZF. The word is that the 991 7sp and PDK are Aisin.
04-28-2012 | 01:26 PM
#33
Race Director
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 12,085
Likes: 247
From: North Bay Area, CA
I'm not arguing with some people's individual opinions but sorry, that's a gross overstatement.
Last edited by Mike in CA; 04-28-2012 at 04:36 PM.
04-29-2012 | 03:11 PM
#35
Rennlist Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 4,019
Likes: 3
From: Scottsdale, AZ
And we get the repeat of what happens whenever a new 911 evolution releases. Seriously, I have C+D articles going back to the 60's and each gen they say the same things... The new ones are improved overall, but softer, bigger/heavier, less involving, and with less of the quirks (handling) that defined the 911. They even said the same things when the "long wheelbase" 911 came out at the end of the 60's.
The 991 is a great car for sure, a needed evolution to keep up with the Joneses... but each gen has it's strengths and quirks. I personally can't decide on which era I like the most... each has it's endearing traits.
The 991 is a great car for sure, a needed evolution to keep up with the Joneses... but each gen has it's strengths and quirks. I personally can't decide on which era I like the most... each has it's endearing traits.
04-29-2012 | 03:12 PM
#36
Rennlist Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 4,019
Likes: 3
From: Scottsdale, AZ
Bollocks. The 996's demise went quite unlamented. Virtually all reviews favoured the 997 on exterior and interior aesthetics as well as chassis handling. And the advent of the S model quashed any complaints about the carrying-over of the 996's powerplant. If anything the 997 rectified much of what many saw as Porsche having strayed from its proud lineage. It wasn't until the 997.2 when Porsche softened, quieted and again (taillights) garishly ventured afield aesthetically, that complaints again resurfaced. The 991 boldly side-steps the lineage of the 911. For some it's exactly what they want. Some of those are newcomers to Porsche for whom the 997 simply demanded more driver involvement than suited their taste. Some are the type for whom driving the newest model takes priority, and they would profess to adore the car no matter what. All of which proves that purely from a marketing standpoint, Porsche is succeeding in its goal to make the car more appealing to a wider market. Whether or not diluting the 911 DNA as much they've done will prove successful in terms of overall sales, is too early to tell.
Sorry missed your post, before I posted mine.
04-30-2012 | 04:06 AM
#39
Nordschleife Master
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 8,513
Likes: 1,069
From: Florida
Never owned one but drove it. Nothing wrong with the way it drove but couldn't get turned on by its looks and that seems to be the most common gripe about it. The coke bottle profile was completely lost but recaptured with the 997. Then came the 991 and...it's all been said already.
04-30-2012 | 11:18 AM
#40
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,716
Likes: 1,451
From: Clifton, NJ
yawn, aren't you clowns done with this by now?
Enjoy your super raw 997s (
) and STFU already.
I don't think any 991 owners are crying into their massive center consoles that some dorks on rennlist think their cars are cushy.
Enjoy your super raw 997s (
) and STFU already.I don't think any 991 owners are crying into their massive center consoles that some dorks on rennlist think their cars are cushy.
04-30-2012 | 11:59 AM
#41
Race Director
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 15,358
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From: Tampa
05-01-2012 | 11:26 AM
#42
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 882
Likes: 8
From: So.FLa/MA
05-01-2012 | 12:16 PM
#43
Rennlist Member
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,230
Likes: 1,287
From: Vancouver, BC, Canada
This all comes down to the quest to achieve the the unachievable - the perfect 911. Each tweak leads to a compromise of some sort, to some degree. The 991 is a stunning beautifully designed 911. But don't try and change it into a 993. It's not. Simply go and buy a second of third car. This ongoing discussion reminds me of skis, or bicycles, or any other sport related gear. You need the variants to fully enjoy the sport. Spend some money boys and fill up your garages! No where is it written that you have to have just one.
05-01-2012 | 12:26 PM
#44
Banned
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 731
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In point of fact, the only (alleged) 991 owners I've encountered are here on Rennlist. Champion's lot full of 991s seems to be unchanged every day when I drive by on my way to the office, and neither I nor anyone I know has seen a 991 round here on the road or at a restaurant, club, country club, or anywhere else... and it isn't as if people here hibernate their Porsches seasonally. I do however know quite a few 997-owning physicians who, like myself, have driven a 991 and either opted to keep the 997 or decided to switch to another car (SL, Aston, Ferrari, etc etc) upon whose niches Porsche are attempting to encroach rather than stick with what made the 911 a unique drive.
05-01-2012 | 03:09 PM
#45
Race Director
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,716
Likes: 1,451
From: Clifton, NJ
In point of fact, the only (alleged) 991 owners I've encountered are here on Rennlist. Champion's lot full of 991s seems to be unchanged every day when I drive by on my way to the office, and neither I nor anyone I know has seen a 991 round here on the road or at a restaurant, club, country club, or anywhere else... and it isn't as if people here hibernate their Porsches seasonally. I do however know quite a few 997-owning physicians who, like myself, have driven a 991 and either opted to keep the 997 or decided to switch to another car (SL, Aston, Ferrari, etc etc) upon whose niches Porsche are attempting to encroach rather than stick with what made the 911 a unique drive.
So you and your friendly crew of 997 owning physicians haven't seen any 991s? Is that supposed to mean something? Surely you know what an anecdote is? Ask porsche how many they've sold if you want some actual useful figures.
Next up, some 997 owners drove the 991 and didn't want one? Ok, again, your point? Some 997 owners drove 993s and decided they liked the older car better. Some 993 owners drove longhoods and decided they liked the earlier car better. I can keep going all day.
Some people will like the new 911 and some won't, 997 owner or otherwise. Just like some people like the 997 and some don't. Lets not be delusional and think that every person who ever drove a 997 liked it.
Finally, some of these people decided to buy aston martins, sls or Ferraris. Thats fantastic. What the hell does it have to do with this?
Some people prefer the 997, others the 991, 996, 993, 964, etc. etc.
Why can't we just leave it there?