lurchphil

I have a 2012 997.2 with PSE. Is the "Gundo Hack" basically the same thing for a lot less money? If I did the Gundo Hack on the PSE, would this enhance the PSE? Curious...

Jaye Bass

I would not get the Gundo with PSE. I have Fister mufflers. The drone is noticeable above 3K rpm when cruising.

SpeedyD

I agree on not getting gundo on PSE (doesn't make much sense) but I have the fister mod plus sharkwerks and no drone... I have experienced drone test driving a car with a different (very pricey) exhaust package but none with my setup...

I can hear the exhaust note when revs are pushing over 3 or 4k rpm but no drone. Just to be clear, drone is an awful resonating vibration / bassy sound in thr cabin that can occur at low rpm because the exhaust system resonance matches other parts of the chassis, causing those to resonate in unison... the result is a low pitch hum that can be really annoying. Hearing exhaust note above a certain rpm that goes louder is just a function of the loudness of the exhaust... in my setup, I can hear the exhaust as the rpm climb (good) but no drone whatsoever... meaning I can drive in near silence for long hwy trips by dropping into 5th and 6th and cruising at hwy speeds.

Just wanted to clarify the drone vs loudness distinction, which are two very different things in my book (and when I experienced drone in the other car the drone actually happened around 2k rpm...or hwy cruising rpm).

Lance-AR

I have the Fister exhaust from FD motorsports. After 40k miles, there is definitely NOT a drone.

pavster

I have my third (plugged) muffler outlet connected to the middle one. Nice bark and no drone whatsoever. If you want to know what drone is, test drive a new 2015-2016 WRX and keep the RPM around 1600-1800, which happens to be the sweet spot for their CVT. The experience is similar to sitting on a nightclub subwoofer.

Carmichael

It still boggles my mind how much money shops charge to do the Gundo/Fister hack.

The Fister Exhaust looks very well done, and you can get it jet-hot coated which makes it attractive for the price.

But to pay a muffler shop $300 to remove the mufflers, weld in $5 pieces of pipe, and re-install the mufflers is ridiculous.

SpeedyD

Well, someone needs to get paid to do the work :-)

I try to find "value" vs. looking at outright price... I got mine (ceramic coated Fisters) because I figured that in the long-run, I'd rather step up with some extra $$ up front but get something where a reputation backs it up. I even paid for my Porsche dealer to do the install on both the SW center bypass AND the fister... talk about pi$$ing money away. But, again, they gave me assurances (email) on no impact on CPO and that it would be done correctly (and that I got a loaner car in meantime). Cost even more since I have my original mufflers too, since I like keeping the stock components...

For the muffler shops that do this, I feel like there has to be a minimum charge for doing this work at all, or it is a waste of their time. The better the shop, the more confidence I'd have in them taking good care of the car... but the more demand they have for their other services. My sense is that for many shops it is not worth the trouble of even doing this work, so I don't think they are charging too much.

SpeedyD

I'm guessing there is a misunderstanding of drone. I agree... you get drone in the very low RPM ranges (typically) which makes it very, very annoying... since when you just want to cruise on a long drive the drone kicks in at hwy speed.

The combo I have has no such drone but it can get pretty loud when you gun the engine, which is precisely what I got it for :-)

Jaye Bass

To clarify, below 3k in top gear the Fisters are very quiet. Above 3k, you can definitely hear them way more than a stock set-up. I like a loud exhaust but even my 964 with Cup Pipe/Cat delete was less annoying at speed.

SpeedyD

Understood but that isn't drone, that is exhaust sound (the sound of the engine working), so I wanted to clarify. Drone can be excruciating because of where it sits in the rev range... down low, usually where people just want to cruise, and the way it manifests itself. It is not the engine sound but rather the effect of the sound waves being compounded through resonance, leading to a very bassy, low and muddy tone.

I test drove some cars with very expensive aftermarket exhausts that droned like hell around 2k revs... and you can feel it throughout your body.

The exhaust note with the fisters is loud but (with center bypass like I have) is exactly how it sounded when I test drove a PSE equipped car with a bypass... once you open it up both can get quite loud.

Droning is something I couldn't live with so I'm pretty thankful that neither my wife nor exhaust setup drone.

MaciejPOL

I did the gundo hack last week using 2in pipe. I haven't heard the other gundo hacked 997 live only on youtube. As much as the sound is kind of cool, i'm thinking it sounds more like damaged muffer than that deep sound of a big. powerfull engine I was hoping for. Maybe they did something wrong at the shop I took my 911 to? But what can you do wrong when welding two pieces of pipe. The shop does only exhausts and been on the market for +15 years.
At the moment I'm considering getting rid of it or maybe trying the 1 or 1,5 in pipe. Any tips? Thanks

Little Green

[QUOTE=MaciejPOL;12485691i'm thinking it sounds more like damaged muffer than that deep sound of a big. powerfull engine I was hoping for. s[/QUOTE]

My feeling here is that first it's really hard to screw this up but it can probably be messed up but maybe the bigger issue is your expectation of sound.

I don't consider the 997 engine a big powerful engine. A 5.0 V8 mustang has what I would consider the starting point for a big powerful engine. We have a flat 6 that in your case may be 3.8L. The fact that porsche has been able to pull solid horsepower out of the engine is great but in reality it's just not a big V8. Nothing will replace that type of sound. Have you ever heard GT3's at a track at WOT? They howl like banshees, it's not the big V* Nascar sort of deep rumble sound you may have been expecting.

MaciejPOL

Your're right, it is not a V8 or V10 engine so I guess I should not be expecting exhaust sound typical for those engines. After over a year of owning my 997 I felt that this car deserved a bit more than the standard exhaust. To me the gundo is quite loud especially with the top down. When I drive to work at 7.30 in the morning I feel like I'm disturbing the peace and quiet of my neighbourhood.
That is why I was considering changing the pipe into 1 or 1,5-not sure how it would change it. I thought that using 2in was the loud and 1in quiet gundo but been through few forums in the UK and apparently it is the other way around?

Little Green

I'm not sure to be honest it would seem a smaller diameter tube would make it raspier and maybe louder than thicker one but I'm not sure. I got mine from Darrin at FD and they sound great. I keep it under 3k rpms in my neighborhood regardless so I don't **** off the neighbors

MaciejPOL

Mine even sounds loud when I put it in drive and with cold engine the rpm's are at 1200-1300