OCBen

You misread my post. I wasn't "intimately describing Porsche's methods." I said I was guessing this is how they likely established their recommended oil change interval (and that their actual data is probably not published anywhere - only those who work for the company would have intimate knowledge here). But typically this is how manufacturers establish recommendations: based on statistics.


Not sure what you want me to see there, but I do see some erroneous information:

The unwanted metallic debris you speak of is being captured and removed from circulation by the filter. Your statement that "fresh oil after break-in" will remove unwanted debris is incorrect.

The filter is what is removing the unwanted debris and taking it out of circulation. That's why I recommend changing just the filter after the 1st 1000 miles to eliminate the possibility of a defective filter passing relatively large metallic particles that it has already captured. There is always a statistical probability that the filter in your car doesn't meet quality standards, and that it slipped through inspection cracks, just as many components that are mass produced do on a regular basis. That's why parts have warranties, to insure against those rare defective units. But because the oil filter performs such a critical function, and the fact that it's relatively cheap, it makes sense to do more filter replacements during break-in than oil changes. Just cheap insurance.

Bob Rouleau

If the filter gets the metal particles, why do we find them on the magnetic drain plug? What about other metals which are not magnetic?

OCBen

I guess the best way to answer that is to see an actual oil circulation diagram of the engine.

If the oil flows down into the drain pan and then through the filter to get cleaned and then up the higher pressure side to make another circulation cycle, my guess is that the magnet is catching the ferrous-based metals before the filter has a chance to catch them. In other words, the magnet is upstream of the filter.

Obviously the filter will catch all debris whether or not it's from ferrous-based metals, whereas the magnet will not.

Clifton

Fact - off the shelf filters can only remove particulates between 30-40 microns. That is good, but ~60% of engine wear occurs from particulate between 20-5 microns. Oil filters help, but they can't remove and take out all unwanted debris.

If you are in a hole, sometimes it is best to just stop digging. Thanks again for the rainbows and unicorns.

Clifton

Where do I buy these magic filters that remove ALL debris?

brendo

unbelievable how often this happens to you ben, statistically speaking, of course.

OCBen

You really need to keep up and follow along in this discussion if you wish to remain relevant.

OCBen

Yeah I know.

I'd say it's inversely proportional to comprehension skills.

Clifton

Absolutely delusional expectation of an off the shelf oil filter. Show me one brand that claims to remove all harmful particulates. If they could, you know they would market that to no end.

The unicorns & rainbows continue....

OCBen

Harmful particulates are those particulates that will do irreparable harm to an engine, such as metal shavings and other such debris that ANY off the shelf filter is designed to remove.

I'm really surprised by your naivete here.

Clifton

Which brand removes all harmful particals again???? Focus on earth first though please....

OCBen

You really need to get educated here. This basic information is apparently over your head.

Any off the shelf oil filter is designed to remove harmful particles that can do irreparable damage to an engine. Those smaller microscopic particles that do pass through the filter - guess what? - they won't harm an engine! They remain suspended in the oil and float about inside the oil boundary between engine components, and is what gives an oil its dirty dark color over time.

But here, since you apparently need to be spoon fed, here's just one of many oil filter manufacturers who make this very claim:

"K&N cartridge oil filters trap harmful contaminants while the filter's construction allows for high oil flow rates."
LINK

And before you get tripped up by words (which you apparently seem to have a problem with) notice the claim doesn't say that their filters trap some or 90% of harmful contaminants. The term is unqualified. And if a term is unqualified, it is all inclusive.

Trust the Porsche engineers. They obviously know more than you.

But if it makes you feel better, change the oil and filter once a week and you should be good to go.

The one unmistakable characteristic of paranoid people is that they tend to irrational. So I won't be surprised if all this goes in one ear and out the other. If so, good luck.

Edgy01

I used to beat a dead horse, and then finally discovered that it remained very slow, despite my best output.

cello

Clifton: Word of warning here. You may have already come the this, but OCBen is the consummate sophist. You are in quicksand. He will play word games until the end. And, so there is no confusion, I do not use 'sophist/sophism' pejoratively but rather in its 'rhetorical' meaning, as I generally enjoy OCBen's posts on this Board. The stuff posted here however is just a play on words advancing an argument, nothing more, and without advancing the thread, IMHO. BTW, I personally change my oil when I feel like it...

OCBen

No sophistry being employed at all. No word games being played either. Show me where my arguments are fallacious. Otherwise don't make such accusations. But I do insist on precision of language. I can't guess what someone may have meant to say, I can only go by what one actually says. And when one has time to review one's post and make necessary edits to make sure that what is typed is what is meant, then there is no excuse for sloppy language.