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A big function of collectibility, desirability, and ultimately market appreciation is production numbers.The low-volume models cited above have an appreciation curve baked into their value moving forward, including the 997-gen equivalents and GT cars. Although I don't think they will necessarily become collector cars, the manual 997s will likely maintain their values for the enthusiast market. Something interesting to keep in mind is that global production for 964 generation was over 66K units (https://www.supercars.net/blog/porsc...ction-numbers/) and over 68K units for 993s (https://www.stuttcars.com/porsche-91...ction-numbers/). Global production of 997.2 was slightly over 50K units (https://www.stuttcars.com/porsche-91...ction-numbers/) due to the global financial crisis.
The merits of .1 and .2 cars are debatable, but the low-volume of .2s bodes well for all the desirable models. Time will tell but I am in the camp that bore scoring is not as big an issue with .2 cars as it is with .1s, which will ultimately add to the collectibility potential. Like Fatsix stated, if you value the qualities of hydraulic steering, smaller size, and aesthetics, hang onto your 997, enjoy the snot out of it, and if it maintains its current value or even appreciates, that is just icing on the cake.
A big function of collectibility, desirability, and ultimately market appreciation is production numbers.The low-volume models cited above have an appreciation curve baked into their value moving forward, including the 997-gen equivalents and GT cars. Although I don't think they will necessarily become collector cars, the manual 997s will likely maintain their values for the enthusiast market. Something interesting to keep in mind is that global production for 964 generation was over 66K units (https://www.supercars.net/blog/porsc...ction-numbers/) and over 68K units for 993s (https://www.stuttcars.com/porsche-91...ction-numbers/). Global production of 997.2 was slightly over 50K units (https://www.stuttcars.com/porsche-91...ction-numbers/) due to the global financial crisis.
The merits of .1 and .2 cars are debatable, but the low-volume of .2s bodes well for all the desirable models. Time will tell but I am in the camp that bore scoring is not as big an issue with .2 cars as it is with .1s, which will ultimately add to the collectibility potential. Like Fatsix stated, if you value the qualities of hydraulic steering, smaller size, and aesthetics, hang onto your 997, enjoy the snot out of it, and if it maintains its current value or even appreciates, that is just icing on the cake.
Well spoken and agreed! I plan to drive the beans off of mine for the long haul. That is, of course after a 15-20 minute oil warming period. Lol
You're sort of correct but not entirely. Air cooled cars have their problems as well and many are known for oil leaks that require the motor to be removed and resealed. This is no cheaper in some cases than an M96/M97 rebuild. Typically, it doesn't matter how old your 911 is. ~$20k is an average cost to get the engine rebuilt. The nice thing is that all parts and solutions are easily available. Heck you can still get a factory M96 block directly from Porsche for about $9k. As with any Porsche, PPI is your best bet and buy the owner and the maintenance before you buy the car.
Yes, this! Head studs, blown air boxes, expensive valve jobs, leaks requiring reseals, rust! etc. Whatever problems 997s have (or may have) is not different than an old air cooled G body or literally every other collector/enthusiast car out there. We could start a thread naming every older collectable car of value in the market today and list its potential flaws. That would be a looong thread!
"collectability" inherently means some significant level of emotional connection. No one's emotionally connected to IMS, BS or any other...BS (pun intended). If ya want the thing, ya buy the thing. If the thing breaks, ya fix it.
Yes, this! Head studs, blown air boxes, expensive valve jobs, leaks requiring reseals, rust! etc. Whatever problems 997s have (or may have) is not different than an old air cooled G body or literally every other collector/enthusiast car out there. We could start a thread naming every older collectable car of value in the market today and list its potential flaws. That would be a looong thread!
"collectability" inherently means some significant level of emotional connection. No one's emotionally connected to IMS, BS or any other...BS (pun intended). If ya want the thing, ya buy the thing. If the thing breaks, ya fix it.
These are simple cars that, when taken care of, are incredibly reliable and durable. The absence of electronics and various "computerized" systems; power equipment; and 1000 lbs of unnecessary weight - make them an absolute joy to own and drive.
The key is to avoid buying one that someone has abused / neglected...
This is a great debate.
Having owned many 356's/early 911's & later 993 I have to say the creature comforts of the 997 is what I really appreciate.
Also the design of the 997 when it is lowered a teeny weeny bit is a great looking car!
IMO our 997's will hold their value over time. Not so sure about huge rise on their market value
But who can disagree that the 356A had an iconic deco design that will live on forever...
My 1959 Super Sunroof
Last edited by groovzilla; 01-20-2024 at 11:45 AM.
That carrera is exceedingly clean. You can't get the engine looking like that if you drive it. And if you drive it, you have to drop the engine, remove the intake runners and put them through a parts washer to get it looking aluminum-like that good. Is that a 98 point car at Concours?
That carrera is exceedingly clean. You can't get the engine looking like that if you drive it. And if you drive it, you have to drop the engine, remove the intake runners and put them through a parts washer to get it looking aluminum-like that good. Is that a 98 point car at Concours?
It's driven. But I am meticulous about taking care of it.
Originally Posted by groovzilla
^^^And those seats look like they've never been sat it?
Ironman making us all look bad with that stellar example
Ironman love those H4's!!! They really complete the Euro look!
I was very lucky to find this car.
It underwent a complete restoration completed 10 years ago. By complete - I'm referring to everything. Full mechanical rebuild. Total paint and body restoration (had no rust). Complete interior redo. Original Porsche leather (black and Can Can red.)
Restoring an air-cooled car to this level is becoming increasingly difficult. Availability of original equipment and NOS parts; and professionals with the skills and specific experience needed to to the job properly.
Mechanical Restoration work - Cantrell Motorsports - Bellevue, Washington
Paint and Body - Queen City Auto Rebuild - Redmond, Washington
Interior work - All City Convertibles and Customs - Kirkland, Washington
Talking about the transition from air-cooled to water-cooled “Mr. 911” August Achleitner - VP for the 911 from 2001-11 - said:
”This is a funny thing…I never understood the debate…we had within the company no discussion about the cooking system.”
”it’s simply a change of how we cook the engine. They’re both flat six, which forms the sound. But now we get it with smaller displacement, lower fuel consumption and much more power. It’s simply a better concept.”
(Thanks for highlighting this article in the December issue of Porsche Panorama magazine @Liste-Renn )
What would a singer 997 even look like? A 997.2 GTS backdated to a 996.1?
Originally Posted by eggsandwich
Where's the 997 Singer?
So much so that I feel I am being programmed to want a 964 or a longhood.
There are a few outfits playing around with restyling and modifying 997s. Edit Automotive out of Germany has reworked 997s starting at $180k. RPM Technik out of the UK developed a bespoked 997.1. No big players yet but there is potential.
I have a 997.1, coupe, 6 speed in seal gray. Car is in pristine condition. I looked at air cooled first but went to 997.1 for more comfort when it comes to my wife wanting to take a trip. I have a '73 BMW 2002tii and my wife has never road in the car, a little to "raw ". This is the first 911 I have owned and love it! Most people think I am driving a $100K value car ....I paid $26,100 four years ago. Just my feed back on the comments.
@Coolwnc ….”when it comes to my wife wanting to take a trip…” CATCH 22…at that point do you downgrade on the Porsche or upgrade the wife?!
Last edited by eggsandwich; 01-21-2024 at 02:45 PM.
01-19-2024 | 12:27 PM
