997.1 with 100k, any point in worrying about the biggies (IMS/Bore scorting)
#46
silver_tt just went down a few rungs claiming he would have purchased this car and sorry to the sellers for me claiming a fasle issue.
Last edited by groovzilla; 12-26-2023 at 09:09 PM.
#47
The irony is that it's not a great picture and would be much easier to see better if it was scoped from the sump. An oil analysis would have made it conclusive as well which was another rookie mistake. Even if I am wrong, it is possible, I don't care and still would like to hear the opinion of Charles, who I consider the best advice you can get on this matter, even if you think it's stupid I do not care at all about your opinion on this matter.
For sure the other photo with a "cracked cylinder" is not cracked and doesn't have bore scoring. I feel very sorry for the owner of that car who was falsely informed of this bull****. If you did this in my job you would be fired FOR SURE and could face prison time for branding yourself as a "veteran" or "expert" but making such a grossly negligent mistake that could cause someone financial damage. You for sure caused them emotional damage for no reason other than you just don't know any better.
What rung I am on in your book means nothing to me. 15,000+ posts of this gibberish....... oh look Rennlist says I'm a "Pro" now under my name because I have 500 posts or some other nonsense. You should stick to giving advice about photography, something you actually might know something about.
For sure the other photo with a "cracked cylinder" is not cracked and doesn't have bore scoring. I feel very sorry for the owner of that car who was falsely informed of this bull****. If you did this in my job you would be fired FOR SURE and could face prison time for branding yourself as a "veteran" or "expert" but making such a grossly negligent mistake that could cause someone financial damage. You for sure caused them emotional damage for no reason other than you just don't know any better.
What rung I am on in your book means nothing to me. 15,000+ posts of this gibberish....... oh look Rennlist says I'm a "Pro" now under my name because I have 500 posts or some other nonsense. You should stick to giving advice about photography, something you actually might know something about.
Last edited by silver_tt; 12-24-2023 at 02:08 PM.
#48
Thread drift, important discussions like this one has evolved into, should have it's own thread!
My novice $.020- though more invasive, the sump removal must have far fewer mechanical steps to achieve a better result.
Gone are the days of scoping cyll 6 and making a decision?
Thanks to both of you, and Merry Christmas
My novice $.020- though more invasive, the sump removal must have far fewer mechanical steps to achieve a better result.
Gone are the days of scoping cyll 6 and making a decision?
Thanks to both of you, and Merry Christmas
#49
Thread drift, important discussions like this one has evolved into, should have it's own thread!
My novice $.020- though more invasive, the sump removal must have far fewer mechanical steps to achieve a better result.
Gone are the days of scoping cyll 6 and making a decision?
Thanks to both of you, and Merry Christmas
My novice $.020- though more invasive, the sump removal must have far fewer mechanical steps to achieve a better result.
Gone are the days of scoping cyll 6 and making a decision?
Thanks to both of you, and Merry Christmas
I always recommend a California car. They seem to age the best especially the undersides!
Good luck in your search.
Last edited by groovzilla; 12-24-2023 at 03:39 PM.
The following users liked this post:
Rig.Stunts (12-24-2023)
#50
Happy holidays to both of you (today it is Christmas in Germany)...
This thread was started by "somethingclever" but this is RL and nothing is ever on topic. Plus based on the information they came here for this conversation and the details unfortunately are highly relevant to them and could have a huge impact on this this individual and the car they end up with. I wish someone would have given me all this detail before I ever bought one of these cars. It is better to know now than to find out later that you made a mistake and didn't price it in -- this happens so often.
We all have a responsibility to post and keep correct information for this community. It is a MASSIVE asset having Charles here and being able to read his posts and I wish Jake was still around but it is stuff like this that is the reason he left, he got tired or arguing with amateurs that have never done it before but think they know better. If you ever see me post patently false information please correct me -- and I 110% mean that -- you will not have hurt my pride or my feelings and you will have helped me and made this community better. There are just only so many times I can see those pictures posted over and over ad nauseum with these false conclusions. It is completely ridiculous. People will come and search these threads later and be led into wrong information by someone they think is an "expert". I don't find this responsible or funny in any way.....
Merry Xmas
This thread was started by "somethingclever" but this is RL and nothing is ever on topic. Plus based on the information they came here for this conversation and the details unfortunately are highly relevant to them and could have a huge impact on this this individual and the car they end up with. I wish someone would have given me all this detail before I ever bought one of these cars. It is better to know now than to find out later that you made a mistake and didn't price it in -- this happens so often.
We all have a responsibility to post and keep correct information for this community. It is a MASSIVE asset having Charles here and being able to read his posts and I wish Jake was still around but it is stuff like this that is the reason he left, he got tired or arguing with amateurs that have never done it before but think they know better. If you ever see me post patently false information please correct me -- and I 110% mean that -- you will not have hurt my pride or my feelings and you will have helped me and made this community better. There are just only so many times I can see those pictures posted over and over ad nauseum with these false conclusions. It is completely ridiculous. People will come and search these threads later and be led into wrong information by someone they think is an "expert". I don't find this responsible or funny in any way.....
Merry Xmas
The following 2 users liked this post by silver_tt:
Rig.Stunts (12-24-2023),
texass4 (12-24-2023)
#51
I see. My plan was to have it scoped first and if it shows some scoring, to ask them to proceed with the leakdown and if those numbers are solid then I’m not going to worry about it because if it has visible scoring that doesn’t affect compression or leakdown it seems like (with 100K miles) it is prob ok. Makes sense no?
#52
#53
But that's not a score mark, that is almost for sure streaking. I'm pretty sure it's just the mark from where the second ring is pinned, this is no big deal and nothing to down a purchase for:
https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...l#post18308290
But going back to the disagreement to scope from the spark plug hole, which is what this whole thing was about because I don't want people reading bad information, it is a moot point as it would be evident when scoped from the bottom regardless.
Charles has stated in the past that if you are about to pull the trigger on a car and email him bore scope photos to LN in a ticket, he will take a look. He is one Hell of a nice person and that's why even though I have zero affiliation with him or his business, I will always try to support his business because he has earned it. I personally also would sample some of the oil from when the sump was dropped and send it to SpeedDiax for measurement. Cheap insurance.......
https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...l#post18308290
But going back to the disagreement to scope from the spark plug hole, which is what this whole thing was about because I don't want people reading bad information, it is a moot point as it would be evident when scoped from the bottom regardless.
Charles has stated in the past that if you are about to pull the trigger on a car and email him bore scope photos to LN in a ticket, he will take a look. He is one Hell of a nice person and that's why even though I have zero affiliation with him or his business, I will always try to support his business because he has earned it. I personally also would sample some of the oil from when the sump was dropped and send it to SpeedDiax for measurement. Cheap insurance.......
#54
Thank you. And thank you in general for the information and experience that you have shared with this community and on your website. I have read all your papers and learned so much from you and your contributions on this platform over the last 20 years. I hope that you will know that I really appreciate it. Happy holidays to you and your family.
#55
All good man, everyone makes mistakes, especially when it's something they have no experience in. I just feel terrible for those two sellers that you told their engines were bore scored and you didn't want to buy their cars because of that. Imagine how that must have made those people feel. And it was all false.
Happy holidays to you and yours.....
Happy holidays to you and yours.....
#56
Groovzilla, I hope you will think about what I said. What you have done is not right and was very irresponsible. You should not have been selling yourself as a borescope expert to folks giving advice in PMs and such as you said. You should have been sending them to a real expert like LN Engineering's email address to create a ticket. You owe both of those sellers a huge apology, which I am sure you will never take the time to give. And now we know never, ever to use Denny Aker (never would have in the first place anyway).
2. I won't buy a 997 that has any questionable marks on the cylinder walls. ---->You go ahead and buy 997's with questionable mrks on cylinder walls. That's your choice although I would caution against it..
3. Both of the Bore Scope photos that are posted in my above posts were from Marque Motors in Portland and Porche Bellingham. I took their advice and didn't buy either one of those cars and glad I went with their recommendation.
4. Your comment about Aker's Porshe is clueless---->. Aker's Porsche is a highly regarded Porsche Specialist shop in both air cooled and water cooled cars. They have PPI'd probably 20 of my Porsche's over the years as well as any other RL members and they have many RL customers. They are one of the most honest shops around. They are neutral when it comes to PPI and don't show favor a customers car when customer is selling.
They PPI'd and Bore Scoped through Spark Plug Holes my current 997 C4 and cylinder walls are clean and Over Rev & Cam Deviation numbers are positive. Aker's does excellent work and they have a great reputation.
My car burns no oil, has never had soot buildup on exhaust pipes and runs like a top.
**I would be careful what you say about businesses you know nothing about especially amongst the Porsche Community. It could be taken as slander.
Last edited by groovzilla; 12-26-2023 at 10:23 PM.
#57
As I was reviewing threads related to this over the weekend for reputable information I couldn't help but to notice that you spam post in every single one always multiple times and it's the same drivel with the same images you posted above over and over. And they are all wrong. Your posts are also very hard to read and looks like something a 12 year old with attention deficit disorder would write, constantly edited, bolding random things, I can't read this crap. If I was able to I would delete your RL account to wipe out all 15,745 posts and net/net this would be a better place for having done it. Get a hair cut and grow up......
The following users liked this post:
Bighank (12-27-2023)
#58
As I was reviewing threads related to this over the weekend for reputable information I couldn't help but to notice that you spam post in every single one always multiple times and it's the same drivel with the same images you posted above over and over. And they are all wrong. Your posts are also very hard to read and looks like something a 12 year old with attention deficit disorder would write, constantly edited, bolding random things, I can't read this crap. If I was able to I would delete your RL account to wipe out all 15,745 posts and net/net this would be a better place for having done it. Get a hair cut and grow up......
At least I proved my point that Scoping from Spark Plug Holes is a viable way to inspect 80% of the cylinder Walls in higher mileage 997 which was the point of my posts.(Incase you forgot)
You can't deny that.
I bet you don't even own a Porsche
Last edited by groovzilla; 12-27-2023 at 09:34 AM.
#59
Mileage has nothing to do with whether or not scoping from the plug holes shows anything or not - it's completely based on how progressive the scoring is and how long ago it started.
If it started recently in a 20k mile 987 or a 100k mile 997, neither may show anything from the plug holes as it starts at the bottom of the cylinder and as it gets worse the piston rings scrape more cylinder metal from the score lines up the walls until it's also visible from the plug holes.
Once it's visible from the plug holes, it's no longer an engine you want, but because it's not visible from the plug holes does not mean it is an engine you do want, it just means you need to move on to the more invasive, from the sump, boroscope.
If it started recently in a 20k mile 987 or a 100k mile 997, neither may show anything from the plug holes as it starts at the bottom of the cylinder and as it gets worse the piston rings scrape more cylinder metal from the score lines up the walls until it's also visible from the plug holes.
Once it's visible from the plug holes, it's no longer an engine you want, but because it's not visible from the plug holes does not mean it is an engine you do want, it just means you need to move on to the more invasive, from the sump, boroscope.
#60
Mileage has nothing to do with whether or not scoping from the plug holes shows anything or not - it's completely based on how progressive the scoring is and how long ago it started.
If it started recently in a 20k mile 987 or a 100k mile 997, neither may show anything from the plug holes as it starts at the bottom of the cylinder and as it gets worse the piston rings scrape more cylinder metal from the score lines up the walls until it's also visible from the plug holes.
Once it's visible from the plug holes, it's no longer an engine you want, but because it's not visible from the plug holes does not mean it is an engine you do want, it just means you need to move on to the more invasive, from the sump, boroscope.
If it started recently in a 20k mile 987 or a 100k mile 997, neither may show anything from the plug holes as it starts at the bottom of the cylinder and as it gets worse the piston rings scrape more cylinder metal from the score lines up the walls until it's also visible from the plug holes.
Once it's visible from the plug holes, it's no longer an engine you want, but because it's not visible from the plug holes does not mean it is an engine you do want, it just means you need to move on to the more invasive, from the sump, boroscope.
So Petza would you have purchased either one of the 2 997's I had scoped showing those marks on cylinder walls??
I was advised not to bt 2 reliable shops.
Last edited by groovzilla; 12-27-2023 at 09:51 AM.