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Good find... thanx.... they were not on my radar and they did not pop up in my searches. Unfortunately, my orders are all ready placed.... only about 10 bucks diff... shipping another variable.
Peace
Bruce in Philly
And California sales taxes are brutal (based on county, usually 10-11%, but they seem to charge about 8% sales tax). Since I am 50 miles from Marin, I usually get the parts the next day for an extra $1 expedited shipping. Not much cheaper than what you found, but they seem to discount everything about 15-25%. They do a great job packing each part sku/part numbered baggies, which helps when you get a bunch of small parts like nuts/screws/bolts.
Always good to have more options at least. Sometimes I go with Suncoast to avoid sales tax, but shipping always takes longer to me.
Update.... I just ordered the parts. Sheesh... this stuff is expensive.... and very oddly priced. My old go-to source, Pelican, is just not the price leader anymore. I have no problem buying OEM, non-Porsche labeled parts. For control arms and such, I tend to prefer TRW or one of the German brands common in the Porsche world. So.... using the Google.... I went all over the place. Rock Auto had great prices on control arms but I did not recognize the brands but it did not matter as I purchased EPS "upgraded" control arms. The bearings were.... I dunno... very odd as Pelican noted the Porsche-labeled unit was $103... but the Porsche dealerships with parts websites had the bearing for about $85. Really odd. There were no alternative, non-Porsche source for the wheel carriers... they are Porsche labeled.
Anywho..... I purchased from two sources: Vertex for the EPS control arms, and Harper Porsche in Tennesee (HarperAutoParts.com) for the wheel carriers and bearings. Every time I order this stuff, I find the 'net is driving all kinds of interesting seller behaviours so it pays... really pays... to use the Google. Vertex is an old, established Porsche source and always has good prices.. I have dealt with them in the past and have been satisfied. However, their wheel carrier prices were high but they carried the EPS arms and one was on sale for a stupid low $74 each!!!.... Harper is a real dealership but they never were on my radar before. I found Harper by using Google "Shopping" where I found a few sources for the wheel carriers... there were some cheaper sources but they did not appear to be dealerships... I went with a dealership for just a few bucks more than the lowest.
I was going to post all the prices from the various sources I scanned... but I dunno.... I will post what I paid for what I purchased. See the link below for the EPS upgraded parts descriptions. BTW, the forward. lateral control arms used to go on my Boxster all the time as they bear the thrust and braking loads directly onto a bushing. Same as the bushing in the wheel carrier... kind of a dopey design given the huge loads. To be honest, neither of these arms are exhibiting trouble... but... I don't want to do this again and the whole thing will be apart so...... and one was on sale for a stupid low price at Vertex....
I still have not made up my mind to do this myself.... but a Rennlister is giving me encouragement as he did it with his Turbo.... so I am leaning to DIY.
I would never put that thing on my car. The arm is not made to get torsional load.
You may very well be correct. Honestly, I am kind of surprised I pulled this trigger so.... I guess I was enamored with the $74.00 price. They were really way cheaper and the lower arm has a replaceable ball joint. I also burned through a few of these lateral arms on my Boxster with that leading bush/ball failing so I saw an opportunity for an "improved" design.
Anywho.... I have time..... I am going to do some more research. I can return the parts if I want to.....
Porsche Marin is the go to IMHO. FCP Euro has been good in the past as well.
I like FCP Euro for their replacement guarantee. I went with OEM rotors and pads from them specifically for that. Ill never have to pay for those items again
I will need to check out Porsche Marin, Don't think I have ever shopped them.
I sent the EPS arms back... getting full credit. I did this for two reasons: 1) These arms have not failed... I was just doing it because I had everything apart, I have high mileage, and what the heck... well heck, they are expensive and I may not have the time to do all of this. and 2) I am not so sure about the "improved" EPS parts. There are some failures out there albeit on track cars. I think I will just stick with OEM/TRW etc when I really need them.
I am still awaiting the bearings and carriers.... were shipped. Next step is to get the bearings pressed in... I will head to a local speed shop for that.
Bruce, great thread, best of luck if you go DIY. Two years ago I installed lowering springs, Tarett mono ball camber plates, GMG sway bar & PowerGrid drop links. After two track events I started hearing a fairly loud tic sound over any uneven surface, basically anytime there was ANY compression in the front suspension no matter how slight. Some said it was the monoball in the camber plate. Some have known issues. Now I'm FEARFUL I have this same issue.
Wish you could drive my car to see if it's the same sound. I'm going to put my car up on the lift soon and check everything out again. Unfortunately everything I do is DIY.
Where in the Phoenixville area are you? I used to live in West Chester area and frequently drive the car to the Malvern/Collegeville areas.
I sent the EPS arms back... getting full credit. I did this for two reasons: 1) These arms have not failed... I was just doing it because I had everything apart, I have high mileage, and what the heck... well heck, they are expensive and I may not have the time to do all of this. and 2) I am not so sure about the "improved" EPS parts. There are some failures out there albeit on track cars. I think I will just stick with OEM/TRW etc when I really need them.
I am still awaiting the bearings and carriers.... were shipped. Next step is to get the bearings pressed in... I will head to a local speed shop for that.
Peace
Bruce in Philly
When I was going though a bit of this LCA research I had called Elephant Racing to figure out some DIY bushing options. I had mentioned the EPS upgraded lower control arms to them and their opinion was that the OEM parts were superior since they are ostensibly already spherical bearings (albeit with a plastic bushing). They said they don't make an "Elephant version" of the part since the OEM part is so good. They didn't seem to have high regard for the EPS product, and eluded that it wouldn't feel as precise as OEM. He said to just consider them a wear item.
Elephant's bushing for the coffin-style LCAs seem good (and expensive...) but you'd still need a coffin with a good ball joint on it. In the end I felt that just buying the OEM stuff had the highest value ratio.
I ended up getting a great deal on all the parts from CARiD (all Meyle brand). The trick was to call in directly to the sales phone number. The sales guy was pressing me to make the transaction with him but I was hesitant about the total price, so he gave me a few instant back pocket discounts that saved me an extra $60. It might be worth giving it a go on your next round of parts.
Similar to TheTorch, for all my other parts, Porsche Marin has consistently been a great resource lately.
I also have a few incredibly irritating small rattles I'm chasing. I actually bought a set of chassis ears on your recco but haven't had much luck finding the culprit yet.
Thanx Westside and others. Yes, I sent the EPS stuff back was credited. I decided not to replace those arms... simply because they are not rattling or clunking. When and if I do, I will replace with OEM... but not necessarily Porsche labeled. I just don't want to bite of more than I can chew over a weekend.
So... sitting in my garage are the left and right wheel carriers, bearings, and new axle nuts. I am in no hurry and am very busy at the moment. I was going to have a shop press in the new bearings but I decided to do it myself. AutoZone rents, for FREE! a bearing press tool so I am going to rent it next weekend and press the bearings in myself. Then, when I have a full free weekend, I will take the dive and do the work. I will then rent, for FREE, an axle puller from AutoZone. Pressing in the bearing and pulling the axle (see part #7 in the diagram) was my big worry. I never did anything like this before, but after some research and with the correct tools, I should be fine. The rest is just unbolt, bolt, and cuss alot.
See below for the parts I will rent. Sorry for taking my time on this, but it is a job that can wait and I want to do it with confidence... and for confidence, I always will have plenty of Pilsner Urquell on hand.
I found the torque for the axle nut is 320 foot pounds!!!! I am going to post a new thread on how to address these high-torque nuts.... stay tuned.. it includes a torque multiplier or... other techniques. Still researching.... Pelican has some advice...
Comments are appreciated. Again, these tools are for FREE at Autozone. So, any tips are appreciated. Note: I will need confirmation that the tools noted below will work.... so changes are likely.
Peace
Bruce in Philly
I already used this guy to separate the lower control arm when I replace the strut:
I will use this pull out the axle #7 on the diagram in my first post:
For pulling (I don't need this) and pressing in bearings, I rented the LARGE kit from Autozone (not the little silver ones that pop up on their website, had to talk to the clerk).
Last edited by Bruce In Philly; 09-11-2020 at 12:00 PM.
... Sorry for taking my time on this, but it is a job that can wait and I want to do it with confidence... and for confidence, I always will have plenty of Pilsner Urquell on hand.
Take your time! You've been one of the most solid resources on this site, and your documentations of all your repairs have all been VERY appreciated.
I look forward to more vicarious learning, and happy to send a six pack of confidence your way if you ever run low.
Thanx Westside and others. Yes, I sent the EPS stuff back was credited. I decided not to replace those arms... simply because they are not rattling or clunking. When and if I do, I will replace with OEM... but not necessarily Porsche labeled. I just don't want to bite of more than I can chew over a weekend.
So... sitting in my garage are the left and right wheel carriers, bearings, and new axle nuts. I am in no hurry and am very busy at the moment. I was going to have a shop press in the new bearings but I decided to do it myself. AutoZone rents, for FREE! a bearing press tool so I am going to rent it next weekend and press the bearings in myself. Then, when I have a full free weekend, I will take the dive and do the work. I will then rent, for FREE, an axle puller from AutoZone. Pressing in the bearing and pulling the axle (see part #7 in the diagram) was my big worry. I never did anything like this before, but after some research and with the correct tools, I should be fine. The rest is just unbolt, bolt, and cuss alot.
See below for the parts I will rent. Sorry for taking my time on this, but it is a job that can wait and I want to do it with confidence... and for confidence, I always will have plenty of Pilsner Urquell on hand.
I found the torque for the axle nut is 320 foot pounds!!!! I am going to post a new thread on how to address these high-torque nuts.... stay tuned.. it includes a torque multiplier or... other techniques. Still researching.... Pelican has some advice...
Comments are appreciated. Again, these tools are for FREE at Autozone. So, any tips are appreciated. Note: I will need confirmation that the tools noted below will work.... so changes are likely.
Peace
Bruce in Philly
I already used this guy to separate the lower control arm when I replace the strut:
I will use this pull out the axle #7 on the diagram in my first post:
For pulling (I don't need this) and pressing in bearings:
Hello Bruce
Hope you are well and that the project is behind you and everything is resolved.
Unfortunately I also have a lot of noises .. (My noises are mainly due to me driving at a low speed on a bumpy road / reflectors) which sound like: "pak pak pak pak" and it is very frustrating to me.
Previously, I had a carrera s 997.1 and the problem was control arm.
I guess this time too is the problem. At the same time, there is no knowing and I always prefer to start by replacing the little things that have never been replaced by me (I with 80KM) such as: end link or sway bar rubbers..
But this time, I want to invest (I never sell my GTS) so I'm considering switching to the best parts there are.
The question: Do I now have to install original parts / original replacements or, Performance part (aluminum metal RSS/RENNLINE / polythene..).
In the same breath, I wonder to myself, I know that if I replace only the "upgraded" end link for example, and do not replace the rest of the suspension parts of the vehicle, can this put pressure on other parts and increase wear on other parts (I do not want that) ?
This is an important question because I know there are parts that can be replaced for the Performance part but then you also need to replace the X, Y, Z part for Performance to balance the pressure on the suspension.
Thanks for the recommendations?
In addition, I would be very happy to know what the torque values of end link, Control Arm Link control arm, upper arm and if there are other parts in the environment that need replacement?
I completed my job of replacing the rear wheel carriers, aka knuckles. Toughest job I ever did and did it without any assistant. Plenty of sweat-inducing situations. I pressed in my own new bearings into the new carriers but had to get a speed shop to remove and press in the hubs... they used a hydraulic press of course. To get my new bearings in, I put the carriers in my home oven and put the bearings in my freezer. Then using a bearing press kit rented for free from Autozone, used my impact gun and they went straight on in without any drama.
My noise was fixed with this replacement as I am 98% sure it was the bushing in the knuckle that was wearing and allowing the lower shock/bolt to make noise. I say 98% sure, because I read that the mounts, on top, are a source of noise, and I decided to go ahead and replace these too. So I am not 100% sure it was that lower bushing. When I used my chassis ears, I put a microphone clip on that lower bolt and it was noisy and super clear. I found I could induce the noise by literally shaking the car. Open the driver door and had a friend (stronger than me) rock the car by pushing up on the roof line. I did put clips on the top of the spring and anything else I could clip those things onto but did not get the metal-on-metal noise from the top. When I examined the old and new shock mounts, I could not see how they make noise as the shock piston is isolated by the foam and rubber parts and the car sits on the spring (on a cushioning seat) where I had the clip... but oh well, I succeeded in killing the noise.
FYI: for replacing the shock mounts, I did not need a spring compressor.. I had one rented just in case, but you don't need one at all.
BTW, the most difficult parts to the job included releasing the emergency brake cable "tube" from the carrier... I did this by freezing the tube. I sprayed fluid from an upside-down can of compressed air... the kind you use for blowing out dust from photography and other equipment. I placed a vice grip on it, then sprayed the inside of the tube while twisting the tube back and forth. The other challenge was re-installing the emergency brake shoes... sheesh! I found the Porsche parts katalog incorrect in that they noted the tube is a separate part, but on my car, it was pinch welded to the cable and was not coming off so I had to pull it out of the carrier.
Another toubling issue is there is a 997 part number cast into the carrier and it did not match the correct part number. This cast number does not match anything and does not come up on Google except for used parts on eBay. The dealer where I purchased the carriers from had no idea why this was so but assured me he sent me the correct parts. So I went under my car with a mirror, and sure enough, the existing carriers had this same, odd part number cast into the factory carriers.
I did not use a torque wrench on the suspension parts for re-assembly. I purchased a set of crows feet to get a torque wrench in there.... of course the set I purchased did not have the sizes I needed ..... very frustrating. Anywho.... I have removed and replace many control arms from my cars and my friends cars so... well... the car has not ejected any parts .... yet.
For torquing the axle nut to 340 ft lbs, there is a trick. I could not find a torque wrench that big and I was going to buy a torque multiplier tool... but that all costs money. The trick is to divide 340 by your body weight. For me, that was 1.7 ft. or 20.4 inches. So, with a breaker bar perpendicular to the ground, I stood on the bar at 20.4 inches, or thereabouts and let the bar settle. It will settle at 340 ft lbs. Coooool.
Regarding replacement parts, many have opinions on this one.... no perfect answer in my opinion. I did not use any "upgraded" parts, but I do use non-Porsche labeled OEM suspension parts like TRW etc. I have heard.... looking for others opinions here... that many of these performance parts use harder bushings and are prone to rattling way faster than OEM arms.
So, in summary, my rear is tight, noise free and I have new bearings in there. And for my high-mileage car that I plan on keeping forever (?), new bearings are a good idea as they will go in time.
Sorry I did not document all of this.... it took me about four days to do both wheels... I go slow... get stuck... research... sleep on it. I was a bit too stressed to take the time to document... there were many procedures that I wrestled with... no time or willingness to spend time taking pictures.... just too complicated for me.
02-04-2020, 02:07 PM
