PPI Results for '08 C4S - need your advice!
05-03-2019, 04:24 AM
#1
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PPI Results for '08 C4S - need your advice!
2008 C4S Cabriolet, Sport Chrono
42k miles
2 owners
Good:
-- Only has revs in range 1 and 2. No revs in ranges 3-6. Looks like car was driven very lightly it's entire life.
-- Interior exterior extremely clean.
Bad:
-- "very slight oil residue sweat at bell housing, appears to be RMS." Mechanic said not nearly enough to worry about, but would keep an eye on it and would only do this RMS when doing the clutch.
-- "clutch slightly worn"
-- slight crack in coolant reservior. no leaks
Car is currently for sale at BMW dealer in Denver, it came in on trade, but I had very reputable mechanic at Porsche in Littleton look at it.
My main concern of course is the RMS. I am asking the dealer to shave $2k off the price tag so I can pay for RMS and clutch to get done to have peace of mind. So far they are resisting.
A) Do I take this car home?
B) If I do, do I do the RMS and clutch (and while there do the IMS)?
If I do all the above, shouldn't the dealer do this or help pay for this since we already see evidence of oil leak?
Curious to hear your thoughts.
42k miles
2 owners
Good:
-- Only has revs in range 1 and 2. No revs in ranges 3-6. Looks like car was driven very lightly it's entire life.
-- Interior exterior extremely clean.
Bad:
-- "very slight oil residue sweat at bell housing, appears to be RMS." Mechanic said not nearly enough to worry about, but would keep an eye on it and would only do this RMS when doing the clutch.
-- "clutch slightly worn"
-- slight crack in coolant reservior. no leaks
Car is currently for sale at BMW dealer in Denver, it came in on trade, but I had very reputable mechanic at Porsche in Littleton look at it.
My main concern of course is the RMS. I am asking the dealer to shave $2k off the price tag so I can pay for RMS and clutch to get done to have peace of mind. So far they are resisting.
A) Do I take this car home?
B) If I do, do I do the RMS and clutch (and while there do the IMS)?
If I do all the above, shouldn't the dealer do this or help pay for this since we already see evidence of oil leak?
Curious to hear your thoughts.
05-03-2019, 08:21 AM
#2
What is the dealer price of these repairs and what is their cost? I would imagine the former is greater than $2k. Either way, if you love the car then do not let $2k spoil the deal. I do not know the implications of the leak reported but I would want it resolved before delivery so you can enjoy the car worry-free.
05-03-2019, 08:39 AM
#3
Advanced
It’s my understanding that a slightly weeping RMS is fairly common for this car at this age. Mine had a similar PPI and I’ve had two different mechanics tell me not to worry about it and just change it with the clutch. Mine only weeps and has never dripped in my garage.
Not really sure sure how they know how worn the clutch is without removing it which I’m sure they didn’t do.
A cracked reservoir is also also fairly common and I would have that fixed or DIY it. Here’s a DIY link. https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...sion-tank.html
Depending on price and if you love the car none of these are deal breakers IMO.
Not really sure sure how they know how worn the clutch is without removing it which I’m sure they didn’t do.
A cracked reservoir is also also fairly common and I would have that fixed or DIY it. Here’s a DIY link. https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...sion-tank.html
Depending on price and if you love the car none of these are deal breakers IMO.
05-03-2019, 08:53 AM
#4
Three Wheelin'
Welcome.
A weeping RMS is fairly common. Its a $20 gasket replacement. Unfortunately you need to take the transmission off to get to it so most guys replace during a clutch replacement. You are getting near that time so $2k is a reasonable budget for both.
As for IMS, the 2006-2008 997s have the new large bearing IMS that doesn't need to be replaced - and cant be. It has an extremely low failure rate so I wouldn't worry about it. (A 2005, on the other hand has the older small bearing that must be replaced).
As for the expansion tank, thats also common. Its a $100 part but the install is a pain in the ***. An indy will likely charge you ~$600, a dealer more like $2k. If you are a DIY guy I have a writeup on how to do it. You probably will want to replace the water pump too if its not already been done.
Driving it with the RMS leak is fine. Its more of an annoyance than a real issue.
I would stick to your guns on the price drop from the dealer. Fun fact: I got a PPI on a Land Rover a few years back that showed a couple grand of repairs required. The used car manager told me now that I had given him documented issues in writing he wasn't allowed to sell it to another customer. He said he would have to fix it or unload it at auction. He was pissed the sales guy allowed me to take the car off the lot for a PPI. Not sure if this was an ethical (doubtful) for legal requirement of the dealer.
A weeping RMS is fairly common. Its a $20 gasket replacement. Unfortunately you need to take the transmission off to get to it so most guys replace during a clutch replacement. You are getting near that time so $2k is a reasonable budget for both.
As for IMS, the 2006-2008 997s have the new large bearing IMS that doesn't need to be replaced - and cant be. It has an extremely low failure rate so I wouldn't worry about it. (A 2005, on the other hand has the older small bearing that must be replaced).
As for the expansion tank, thats also common. Its a $100 part but the install is a pain in the ***. An indy will likely charge you ~$600, a dealer more like $2k. If you are a DIY guy I have a writeup on how to do it. You probably will want to replace the water pump too if its not already been done.
Driving it with the RMS leak is fine. Its more of an annoyance than a real issue.
I would stick to your guns on the price drop from the dealer. Fun fact: I got a PPI on a Land Rover a few years back that showed a couple grand of repairs required. The used car manager told me now that I had given him documented issues in writing he wasn't allowed to sell it to another customer. He said he would have to fix it or unload it at auction. He was pissed the sales guy allowed me to take the car off the lot for a PPI. Not sure if this was an ethical (doubtful) for legal requirement of the dealer.
05-03-2019, 10:36 AM
#5
Rennlist Member
FYI - Leaking on Bell Housing at RMS area can also be leaking from one of the IMS seals - I forget exactly which one but 2 years ago my 2005 997S with later model engine with larger IMS bearing was leaking from this area and mis-diagnosed as RMS leak during PPI
Seal was replaced and all was good.
***Make sure you factor in $1500 for repair when u grind on seller - Also if you decide to have that seal replaced, make sure your mechanic removes the IMS Bearing outer greas seal for better oil flow as recommended
.
Seal was replaced and all was good.
***Make sure you factor in $1500 for repair when u grind on seller - Also if you decide to have that seal replaced, make sure your mechanic removes the IMS Bearing outer greas seal for better oil flow as recommended
.
05-03-2019, 01:38 PM
#6
Three Wheelin'
Take the car ....all those seals sweat including mine ... Don't worry about it .... Tell them you will meet them half way -$1000 and if they decline ask them to work with you and to shave -$500 at least for the reservoir replacement and go for it. You wont need to replace the seal or the clutch for at least for a few years get some drive time and more wear on them before you replace. Just do the reservoir asap.
Nice low K's and an excellent rev report buy it and DRIVE !! ... I have the same ride 2006 and I have yet to do the clutch or seal yet .... save your cash for the time being ...42 on that car that clutch still has meat on it for awhile.
Nice low K's and an excellent rev report buy it and DRIVE !! ... I have the same ride 2006 and I have yet to do the clutch or seal yet .... save your cash for the time being ...42 on that car that clutch still has meat on it for awhile.
05-03-2019, 08:38 PM
#7
Three Wheelin'
I wouldn’t let any of that bother me. If it was really babied you probably have another 50k on the clutch. As for the coolant tank. It is actually a pretty easy fix and is not so bad. I did mine in under 2 hours. Oh yea and my original clutch has 91k on it.
Last edited by doclouie; 05-03-2019 at 09:18 PM.
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05-04-2019, 08:58 AM
#8
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
If that car has been sitting on the dealer lot for a little while, it's also possible that the leak might get a little better once you start exercising the seals.
If you buy it, clean up that area and monitor how bad it's actually leaking.
If you buy it, clean up that area and monitor how bad it's actually leaking.
05-04-2019, 10:52 AM
#10
Rennlist Member
There's tons of preventative maintenance to do anyway, like water pump, coolant reservoir, coil packs, plugs, 3 idler pulleys, belt, engine mounts etc..... not counting tranny, brake and awd oils and all.....
I wouldn't let an RMS gasket stop my purchase if it doesn't leak on my garage floor, and I would most likely plan a clutch change/ rms replacement and IMS outer seal removal at the same time.
I wouldn't let an RMS gasket stop my purchase if it doesn't leak on my garage floor, and I would most likely plan a clutch change/ rms replacement and IMS outer seal removal at the same time.