The big debate: sell the 997...?
#46
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
#47
Nordschleife Master
I own both a G-series and a 997.2 and have owned others. The water-cooled is an acquired taste but for someone exposed to the 911 series with a 997.1, it is a very different car. Perhaps a 993 is closer, but anything before 1987 is a very different experience. A classic is not an enjoyable car in Bay Area traffic and in Bay Area road surfaces. The OP should try to drive one and see for himself; maybe he adapts or not.
#48
Depends what you want, what you use the car for and what "season of life" you are in. My 997.2 is my 7th 911, all of the prior were air cooled, some modified, some not. I bought the 997 because I now have a young family and want them to enjoy the Porsche experience... the comfort and safety of air conditioning, rear seat belts, air bags and nannies allow us to reasonably do that.
I feel bad even saying it because I’ve had 20k miles of fun with my 997. However Werks ruined me. I saw a bunch of air cooled hot rods and started thinking about building my own. I’ve decided I like the car projects as much as I like driving. I’ve fixed and cleaned everything that needed fixing and cleaning on my 997 and...I’m bored.
Unfortunalely I don’t have the garage space or budget for 2 so I listed my car to see what type of offers I would get. The good news is I got 2 local offers for 20% more than I paid, after putting 20k miles on it. Not bad.
As as an aside, there are two conclusions I’ve drawn from this: First, at the prices of 997.1s today it’s essentially a “free car”. Second, I believe the base model 997s hold their value better than S models as you increase in mileage. They both coverge towards a $30k floor at 100k miles.
The bad news is now I need to make a real decision.
Option 1: Sell it and make a few bucks towards an air cooled project. The most fun, the least practical. While I think I would love fixing it up I’m unsure how I will like driving an older car and how many times I will end up taking an Uber when the car won’t start. I also want a car I can drive the **** out of with no worries about putting miles on it.
Option 2: sell it and hunt for another good deal on a low mile 997, fix it up and sell at 60k miles. Basically rinse and repeat.
Option 3: keep it for the long haul. At the miles I’m putting on it I will roll 100k in 3 years. Look to add an air cooled car at that time (hopefully when the garage or fun budget increase in size).
Thoughts, experiences appreciated.
Unfortunalely I don’t have the garage space or budget for 2 so I listed my car to see what type of offers I would get. The good news is I got 2 local offers for 20% more than I paid, after putting 20k miles on it. Not bad.
As as an aside, there are two conclusions I’ve drawn from this: First, at the prices of 997.1s today it’s essentially a “free car”. Second, I believe the base model 997s hold their value better than S models as you increase in mileage. They both coverge towards a $30k floor at 100k miles.
The bad news is now I need to make a real decision.
Option 1: Sell it and make a few bucks towards an air cooled project. The most fun, the least practical. While I think I would love fixing it up I’m unsure how I will like driving an older car and how many times I will end up taking an Uber when the car won’t start. I also want a car I can drive the **** out of with no worries about putting miles on it.
Option 2: sell it and hunt for another good deal on a low mile 997, fix it up and sell at 60k miles. Basically rinse and repeat.
Option 3: keep it for the long haul. At the miles I’m putting on it I will roll 100k in 3 years. Look to add an air cooled car at that time (hopefully when the garage or fun budget increase in size).
Thoughts, experiences appreciated.
#49
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If I could find a good deal on a track car I'd pull the trigger. You can easily make them street able, especially if you are going for the outlaw look. Plus, they'll probably have a bunch of components already installed that you would need to buy on a fresh build.
I had my 997 for about 4-5 months and found an incredible deal on a red GT3 that I could't refuse. I had a buddy who wanted my 997 so it all worked out! I couldn't be happier.
I had my 997 for about 4-5 months and found an incredible deal on a red GT3 that I could't refuse. I had a buddy who wanted my 997 so it all worked out! I couldn't be happier.
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#50
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
So my air cooled blue crush passed me by but option 2 is still in play.
I ran across a 997.1 GT Silver on Black C2S with 44k miles, leather dash and doors, sport chrono, 6sp, Carrera Sport wheels (my fav). 40k mile service just done and CPO checklist by the CA Porsche dealer listing it.
Variable #1: Its a 2005. I wasn't bent. Figured it had an upgraded bearing or I could price into the sale. It was an extremely painful process to confirm if it was upgraded or not. The service department gave a bunch of nonsensical answers which the sales rep conveyed to me. After some scolding on his lack of knowledge he admitted he had only been selling Porsche's for 10 months and wasn't terribly educated about 997s. His apology was sincere and he offered to knock $2k off the price for consideration since they couldn't confirm.
Variable #2: He gave me the engine number and it appears its after the cutoff date and has the large bearing. However, according to Jake Raby there is no way to definitively know with a 2005 so this is a guesstimate.
Based on the info published on RL engine number up to M97/01 68509790 has the older IMS bearing and Engine number from M97/01 68509791 has the larger revised IMS. This is 68511021.
Variable #3: Its not GT Silver. They misrepresented it. I called him on it and he apologized. He said their web department had a bunch of dealerships under the same family and they get things mixed up.
Variable #4: 9% CA sales tax doesn't make trading cars terribly practical.
What would you guys do?
I ran across a 997.1 GT Silver on Black C2S with 44k miles, leather dash and doors, sport chrono, 6sp, Carrera Sport wheels (my fav). 40k mile service just done and CPO checklist by the CA Porsche dealer listing it.
Variable #1: Its a 2005. I wasn't bent. Figured it had an upgraded bearing or I could price into the sale. It was an extremely painful process to confirm if it was upgraded or not. The service department gave a bunch of nonsensical answers which the sales rep conveyed to me. After some scolding on his lack of knowledge he admitted he had only been selling Porsche's for 10 months and wasn't terribly educated about 997s. His apology was sincere and he offered to knock $2k off the price for consideration since they couldn't confirm.
Variable #2: He gave me the engine number and it appears its after the cutoff date and has the large bearing. However, according to Jake Raby there is no way to definitively know with a 2005 so this is a guesstimate.
Based on the info published on RL engine number up to M97/01 68509790 has the older IMS bearing and Engine number from M97/01 68509791 has the larger revised IMS. This is 68511021.
Variable #3: Its not GT Silver. They misrepresented it. I called him on it and he apologized. He said their web department had a bunch of dealerships under the same family and they get things mixed up.
Variable #4: 9% CA sales tax doesn't make trading cars terribly practical.
What would you guys do?
Last edited by TheBruce; 04-23-2019 at 12:49 AM.
#52
Rennlist Member
I agree the price isn't bad if you can get it for $37k. But I'd definitely make sure you've checked it thoroughly yourself and aren't listening to the dealer at all, since it seems they don't know anything about this car.
If it were me, I'd get my own PPI as well.
Good luck.
If it were me, I'd get my own PPI as well.
Good luck.
#53
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
I would sell my C2 and swap out for this. Already one firm offer for mine that I’ve been dragging my feet on.
The funny part is I bet my wife would have no idea. The conversation with her why I would trade one silver 911 for another silver 911 will be painful.
And yes no way I would buy buy it without flying down and getting a ppi on it. It’s in SoCal so can do another road trip back up 25 and 33 with it...
I’m wondering if any hacks to confirm large or small bearing without taking the transmission off.
The funny part is I bet my wife would have no idea. The conversation with her why I would trade one silver 911 for another silver 911 will be painful.
And yes no way I would buy buy it without flying down and getting a ppi on it. It’s in SoCal so can do another road trip back up 25 and 33 with it...
I’m wondering if any hacks to confirm large or small bearing without taking the transmission off.
Last edited by TheBruce; 04-23-2019 at 12:49 AM.
#54
Racer
I drive the 997.2 more than the air cooled in the bay area since I got it 5 months ago. Maybe because it has better AC, 6 speed shifts smoother than the 915 and I am enjoying the mods I did on the 997 and kept the air cooled stock as possible. It didn't bother me driving to the city once in a while with the air cooled but that changed when the 997 came as I realized I can use this more often in the city uphill/downhill in downtown SF and still feel comfortable.
I am the opposite of what you are planning, I am on the fence of selling the air cooled as it doesn't get the usual seat time it did before plus renting for 2 private garages in the bay area is like renting a room in Daly City, lol. Though I am not in a rush to sell it, the thought of me selling it in favor of the 997 gives you more of an idea where I am at.
I am the opposite of what you are planning, I am on the fence of selling the air cooled as it doesn't get the usual seat time it did before plus renting for 2 private garages in the bay area is like renting a room in Daly City, lol. Though I am not in a rush to sell it, the thought of me selling it in favor of the 997 gives you more of an idea where I am at.
#55
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Perhaps you should just tuck this GT Silver beauty in the garage and see if your wife notices anything out of the ordinary?!
https://rennlist.com/forums/vehicle-...ver-black.html
https://rennlist.com/forums/vehicle-...ver-black.html
#57
Three Wheelin'
Perhaps you should just tuck this GT Silver beauty in the garage and see if your wife notices anything out of the ordinary?!
https://rennlist.com/forums/vehicle-...ver-black.html
https://rennlist.com/forums/vehicle-...ver-black.html
#58
I too support David's idea. Problems keeping it at home ... park in my garage. I'll keep the battery charged 8)
#59
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Ha!! The GT3 is an argument I wont mind having with my wife...
@Wayne - be careful, I may take you up on that but instead of a GT3, you will find a rusty SC in boxes.
Just back from meeting the guy who put the offer on my car. He's ready to buy Monday if I agree. Told him I need a few more days. Oh the decisions...
@Wayne - be careful, I may take you up on that but instead of a GT3, you will find a rusty SC in boxes.
Just back from meeting the guy who put the offer on my car. He's ready to buy Monday if I agree. Told him I need a few more days. Oh the decisions...
#60
Ha!! The GT3 is an argument I wont mind having with my wife...
@Wayne - be careful, I may take you up on that but instead of a GT3, you will find a rusty SC in boxes.
Just back from meeting the guy who put the offer on my car. He's ready to buy Monday if I agree. Told him I need a few more days. Oh the decisions...
@Wayne - be careful, I may take you up on that but instead of a GT3, you will find a rusty SC in boxes.
Just back from meeting the guy who put the offer on my car. He's ready to buy Monday if I agree. Told him I need a few more days. Oh the decisions...