rmc1148

My buddies mint 1987 928s4 got totaled on a track by other driver= no fault of his own. Another subject that people will never agree upon.

BioBanker

Of course they're the drivers fault. All of them. Even when a part breaks and the car goes off as a result, it's the drivers fault for not replacing a part that was about to break before it gave out. Most of my days were at Mosport, a pretty unforgiving track, and yes it was more unusual to get through a day without incident than to have one. One day a cars coolant let lose on a HPDE and the wall collected the next 12 cars which were traveling 130-140mph. Who's fault? Everyone who got caught in it.

Turbo brakes overheat quickly, super fast on some tracks. They're too heavy and the GT3 got the better brake parts.

Now if your talking about using a HPDE to drive essentially the same as you would in a spirited fashion on the street, but in a legal setting, then I guess that is different. However, that's not what anyone else is talking about.

Warehouse33.net

That's gotta be a fun swap, I'm thinking about doing that in my e36 sometime next year. It seems to be a pretty straightforward swap.


-Jason

FRUNKenstein

Yeah, this guy was enjoying some spirited driving on the street rather than taking it to the track.
http://www.cnbc.com/2015/11/17/paul-...t-porsche.html

Honestly, I am surprised that so many people are advocating spirited street driving rather than taking the car to a place where you can legally, and much more safely, let it stretch its legs. SMH.

hyboost

It's a blast. 2490lbs, 340whp, e46m3 ABS, dry dump, MCS DA's...good enough for 2:21's at Sebring in 90 degree weather. My old man swapped the s54 into his daily/DE e36m3 and it was a much easier swap than e30. Randy at EpicMotorsports provides the harness and tuning for us on all the swaps we do.

Freddie Two Bs

Or maybe there's a middle ground, between being a hero and striving to "win" your run group and mount slicks and attack every curb like your life depends on it and brake to within half an inch of the threshold and overall push the car ballz out to 10/10, and driving "in a spirited fashion".

The GT3 is a 100% track-focused car, it doesn't mean that you can't have an extremely rewarding and perfectly safe day driving your "normal" porsche to the track in the morning, doing four 25-minutes runs while respecting the car's limitations and aware of your own skillset, and then drive back home at the end of day.

I've seen all sorts of cars being taken to the track, and their owners have the time of their life and then drive their car back home at the end of day. Many regular, non-GT3 911s, two-ton plus CTS-Vs and AMGs, regular mustangs and camaros and corvettes. An old 70's Datsun, a De Tomaso pantera. A diesel Jetta.

FRUNKenstein

^ Well said.

Carlo_Carrera

And my buddy's 997 turbo got T-boned and totaled at an intersection driving to dinner after doing an entire day at an HPDE. Accidents happen everywhere.

Carlo_Carrera

Perfectly said, thanks.

Carlo_Carrera

In order to fully assess blame for the accidents you described I need some more information.

What type of car, year, what broke, driver maintained, was there proper flagging? That sort of stuff.

As for the Turbo brakes, my friends and I who run Turbos at HPDEs have never had any brake overheating issues at any circuits including Watkins Glen which is a brake destroyer. All we do is run track pads and super high temperature fluid. Are you maybe having issues with a Turbo that has been tuned to high HP?

As for how HPDEs should be driven I think you have been improperly instructed. HPDEs are not racing, not even close. If you have folks crashing out at the rates you claim then your entire DE program is being mismanaged. In my region if we have even a single bad wreck everything stops and a driver meeting is called to remind everyone what we should and should not be doing out there. HPDEs are not racing and I have been saying that from the very beginning. Notice my past post where I state, "driving in an HPDE is just like driving on the street except there are no speed limits..."

Carlo_Carrera

Sweet.

rmc1148

The difference is he nor the other guy had insurance but I see your point. I would have a dedicated track car if I wanted one but its a matter of budgets for some and they use their street car= who really cares as its a personal choice.

rmc1148

Hyboost put some pics up of your M3 if you can, curious why you picked a E30 M3 for a track car= was it original when you got it?

Carlo_Carrera

I buy special track insurance so I am always covered.

I used have a dedicated track car but once I tried my 996TT on track I knew it could be my "Swiss Army Knife" so I sold my track car.

I track my 996TT and both my wife and I use it as a daily driver. I have literally driven the car home from the track and immediately swapped out the R compounds for street tires because my wife wanted to take it to go get groceries. It is a great piece of engineering.

You are correct. It is a personal choice but I find it very disturbing that some think you are better off stretching this car's legs on the street than the track.

rmc1148

From what I've seen/heard most do not buy the insurance= have no facts to back this up. I personally live too far away from a track to make it feasible/practice, at least as far as I'm concerned. I do not speed on public roads as a rule and have purposely broke the speed limit only once in my 996t. I have too much land and other responsibilities so the car thing takes a back seat at this point in my life.