BOBBYFALI

I have posted this on 6speed & I am reposting it here in hope that someone on here might shed more light on this frustating situation. I just cut and pasted some of my responses to the tread on 6speed so we can have some idea of what hs been done already etc.

Thanks in advnce for all your input and help!


10/12/12
I was going out to see a fellow 6speed'er so he can see the difference between his flashed/exhaust car and a EPL K16G package car.

I was driving and power was coming on hard and strong as usual (with the cold weather 2nd just spinning to redline). I did a pull and saw 1.5 bar and then by the time I noticed it went down to 1.3 (where it is tuned to run). I cruzed for about 2-3minutes and hit it again and was waiting for the power to come on line as a gripped my wheel waiting....waiting....waitng .... I looked down to the boost gauge thinking it was going to read 0 as in a massive boost leak, but to my surprise it was 1.3BAR, but feeling like a flashed only car!
The boost is laggy and feels down like 100HP.

I drove the car and noticed that by the time I drove it home the car was losing boost down to only 0.9BAR .

I hooked up my durametrics and the only fault codes were miss fire in 3 cylinders (most likely just from start up as the car idles very rough until warm).

From my turbo experience, it feels like a boost leak as in a small rip in a coupler that cracked and is now getting bigger. I understand this is a new platform that has many little nuances, so before I go spend money on something that might be a common issue (ie maybe a MAF, or limp mode etc.) I thought I might see what input my fellow 6Speed'ers might suggest. I am just sick of paying Porsche tax for simple fixes and know that the Porsche shop I bring it to would be over $300 just to do a boost test and that might not include before AND after turbos. I just got my car running well after many issues and have spent over 19K+ in mods and fixing (7k of the 19K are fixing) things since I purchase this car in May!! I have enjoyed/driven this car about a max of 2 months in total out of the 6 months!

I do not know if this has anything to do with this issue now, but just encase. I was having over boosting issues just before and replaced my N75 valve and the 3 hoses that goes to it and zip tied down everything. That dealt with the over boosting, but later that day it started over boosting again. I tightened two zip ties by the N75 valve further and the car was boosting properly again (1.3BAR). The c

I am going to take it to work (at a dealership) and see if I can put it on a hoist to see if all the intercooler hoses underneath looks good and see if the coupler on the throttle body is ripped etc. (hopefully I have the time).

Any help or suggestions would be helpful and much appreciated.


Thanks

Bobby Ali

Ba


10/16/12

I just got a report back from the shop that is looking for this power/boost loss and they said that there is no leak!! They said they smoked tested it, then tested it under pressure and tested the FORGED valves to make sure it is not leaking.

I have the following codes:

353-Pressure sensor boost pressure exceeds limit value
440-Pressure sensor boost pressure Porsche fault code
507-Misfire detection (total)
509-Misfire cylinder 6
511-Misfire cylinder 4
513-Misfire cylinder 5
512-Misfire cylinder 3

I just changed my N75 valve last week with all new hoses that attach to it and zipped tied them down. That seemed to of dealt with the over boosting problems, being I couldn't not even get on it without it over boosting past 1.4.

I thought the misfires had to do with my cold start up, being it idles like a big v8 heavy cammed car, but when it warms up is fine.

The shop told me that they think it is a boost sensor that died or my plugs, but is it just me, but that does not sound right.

How can plugs limit boost.... and most of all after one pull I have feel power, then I get on it again and immediately lose power. I know what blow out feels like....this feels like the boost air is not getting into the motor, but as of their test I am wrong!!!

Again, any input form other members experiences would be a GREAT HELP before I start spending money for now reason. (He wants $700 just labour to do plugs and I feel that they are not even related!).

Thanks

Bobby Ali

Ba

10/16/12

Tony,

thanks for your input, it is much appreciated!

The over boosting was dealt with the change of the N75 valve.
I am now dealing with the car not making the power it did at the same boost level (1.3BAR) and it wasn't a slow decent in power. It was pulling hard like regular then the next pull, "where did the power go", but yet it showed 1.3 BAR. Since then the boost has been coming down and when I dropped it off at Autowerks this morning it is down to 0.9BAR.

10/18/12

I just called Autowerks and they said they replaced the MAP sensor and the car is running smooth. They said the only problem is that it is only boosting up to 1.0bar when it is tuned to 1.3BAR!!

They said it feels strong, it is not pulling any fault codes, not idling rough, but will not go over 1.0BAR!

Again, when this situation happened it still boosted up until 1.3BAR, but down what felt like 100hp and 150ft/tq. It started dropping boost and even at 1.0BAR when it got down there it didn't even feel nowhere as strong as my stock car with 0.9 flash (RENNTECH) tune! So when the shop is telling me that it is running strong on 1.0BAR I would have to be the judge of that, because not because it is even running 1.0BAR doesn't mean it is making the 1.0BAR of power on the set up I have that it is supposed to.....Let alone why it is not running 1.3BAR!

I am running out of ideas and $$.

Thanks

Bobby Ali

Ba

10/19/12

Went there today and the ca is not boosting 1.0 BAR, but the same .8-.9BAR when I brought it to them. Like I suspected the power is down ALOT for even .9 BAR. My stock car with just a RENNTECH tune at .9 felt ALOT stronger.

I asked them to log requested boost verses actual and they did confim that the car is asking for 1.3BAR but it is only getting .9.

I spoke to the owner and told me that he hears some "whirring" of air that I am hearing and he knows there is a leak, but he needs time to find it. I was under the impression that he never looked at the car himself as he said he has been busy, but assured me as soon he has time to put towards it he WILL find it. I feel a little at ease that Courtney the owner didn't look over the car completely, so I feel some hope as he has been wrenching on Porsches for many, many years. So with fingers cross with him looking at it he should find this gremlin!!

I guess on and off for the past four days he had his apprentice's look at it…I don't know???

Again thank you guys for all you suggestions and help!

Thanks

Bobby Ali

ba

crazyfrog

A pressure test would be a good start to investigate . That is the 1st thing to do with bi-turbo .

BOBBYFALI

After 2 weeks and they still have not found the issue and I know most if not almost all of that time the car has been in a corner of the shop.

They said that they have pressure tested it many times and now think it is some blockage in the exhaust ! That blockage is holding back the motor/turbo from spooling????

I have been around turbo cars awhile and that has never happened unless it was a blown turbo. I asked him if he thinks it is that and he said no. What physical object can block an exhaust that can cause a sudden lost of power like that? They are going to take down the exhaust and look at the cats etc.

I have this gut feeling that it is something leaking and they are not checking properly via a proper leak test under pressure and not just doing a pressure test from only under the car.

Is there a link were I can see how to do a COMPLETE AND THOROUGH boost leak test that I can bring it to them and make sure they are doing that. I am going to swing by tomorrow, so if I have that it would be great!


Thanks

Bobby Ali

ba

slant911

A squirrel?

All joking aside.....Have you considered another shop? Sounds like maybe you are not top priority for them. Hope you get it worked out.

BOBBYFALI

Quote:
Originally Posted by JETmn
I would say get your car out of there and take it to a different shop. It is nearly impossible for it to be something in the exhaust unless someone physically stuck it in there from the back side or the cats are clogged. Nothing is going to make it through the turbo that could block the

I agree that they probably don't know what to do at this point and that is why the car is just sitting there.
The part that I feel so helpless is that these cars are such specialty cars and I feel that is where these very few Canadian shops have us by the neck!

I brought it to a well renown Porsche specialist and if they can't fix this, then who can?

Does anyone know another proven Porsche specialist, that works on modified 911's?

Thanks

Bobby Ali

BA

Kevinmacd

How are the divertor valves, and are the waste gates working correctly.

crazyfrog

Are the actuators work properly ? Do they close properly ? if your exhaust is coming off to have the cats checked it is a good occasion to see if the flaps in both turbos close fermely. check the movement of the actuators . They must move really freely. My car had a sticky actuator on one side. the arm /pivot was stiff due to corrosion. the flat was a bit open during boost build up and I had about 0.3/0.4 bar missing....It is quite common on 996tt. actuators+ arm and pivot need to be check from time to time. To maintain then you can buy some can spray that does brake the corrosion. Spray it directly on pivots and move the actuators forward backward many time. It does the trick sometimes.

BOBBYFALI

I am now entering my third week and still now resolutions. They check the cats and the hot side of my turbo's and all seem fine. He also said the wastegates are opening and closing fine.



He said he is going to check the cold side of the turbo for damage (why this was not done at the same time ).



They also said that it might be my ECU and if I can re flash the tune to see if it is that or a bad ECU.



I asked what PSI did you pressure test and he said 6-7psi's. I told them many times before that some boost leaks only show at higher PSI's i.e. a hose lifting or clamp at only higher psi's and hence the leak) 15psi and being my car is supposed to be running 19psi and it is only running 12psi we should at least be testing at 12psi. I told them how in the past on my Supra that this was the case that I would test at lower psi and nothing, but at higher my throttle body coupler would push air out. I have suggested testing at higher PSI's from day one and now that nothing has been resolved I mentioned it again and he thinks that is not the issue. After I asked him a couple of times he said he will try that, but I am not sure if it will really be done. He also said he is not use to Porsche running that high PSI's, and I am like really and this is a performance shop. He said he is use to just flashes about 1 to 1.1 bar.....so I have no idea.



I asked them to check the cold side of the turbo's and test at higher psi for boost leaks again and then we will try to re-flash and see if it is electronically related (I don't think it is hence the reason I am pushing for the for-mentioned to be done first).



It is either my car is obviously not a priority or this is really something hard to diagnose. I just don't understand being these guys work on Porsche's and are supposed to know there stuff.



Guy thank you for all your suggestions so far, I feel I just don't want to think about this any more.....



Thanks



Bobby Ali



ba

Kevinmacd

So how are the divertor valves? In the sense they are slow in moving. The piston type valves will stick and need to be lubricated or replaced.

BOBBYFALI

They are only 6 months new. They said they tested it and they were fine.

Thanks

Bobby Ali

ba

BOBBYFALI

The cats were the issue!



I am just grateful for this situation being resolved!



One of the cats broke in half stopping the flow completely, being the main culprit and on the other side it was starting to break up.



We just hollowed them out, put O2 spacers and the car IS STRONGER THEN EVER! I am wondering if my cats were on the way out from before this incident and finally when the other side just broke in half completely stopping the flow. The reason I am saying that is usually you pick up about 14-20AWHP over the 100cell cats at my power levels and you can't really notice that difference at this power level. I can feel this power differance and if feels more like a 25-40AWHP bump.



Previously the power would slow down at about 6500rpms to a point I would not even need to look at the tech to shift, now the cat just pulls to red line and with out me looking down I now sometimes hit rev limiter.



My Speedtech exhaust went from a great sounding exhaust to an AMAZING sounding and the higher up in the RPM band that AMAZING sound becomes exponentially better!



Again, I would like to thank everyone for there advice and support!





Thanks



Bobby Ali



ba

crazyfrog

Great !!!! Was it the Speedtech cats which broke ? 100cells type? How many miles did you do with the system ? Glad it is all sorted !!

John D II

Cats will not fail catastrophically like this unless they are exposed to a running issue. Cats are known to fail in this manner when a car is running too rich and unburned fuel is passed into the red hot cat where it then ignites, causing termperatures in excess of 2000 degrees. Also, I believe this system was recently purchased used, so anything could have gone on it it's prior life to weaken the cats...IMO, at some point these cats were exposed to abusive conditions leading to the failure. This is certainly not a normal occurance with our or any cats!

BOBBYFALI

Fully agree with your comments. This exhaust system was purchased pre-owned. Judging by the high quality of this complete system, I have no doubt that this quality is carried throughout all components of your exhaust system and that this unique situation does not happen with your cats!

I would still purchase a set of cats from you with out a doubt and might give you a call soon, but I am loving the cat less life right now!!

Even though I didn't purchase this exhaust from you new, you treated me as if I did. Straight from my R&D stage to even when I purchased it used and even helping problem solve this power loss issue through PM!! This is one of many reasons I know that I made the right choice by having Speedtech on my machine!

Thanks Alot!

Bobby Ali

ba

John D II

Hi Bobby,

Thanks for the kind words!

Chad and I are anxiously awaiting another of your "stalking prey" stories :-) That last one was quite a captivating read...

Take care and enjoy - that 3.0 catless you are running now is Chad's favorite system we make - Personally, I like the 2.5 "quiet" catted...