Dock

Right...a grand cabal.

Dock

More reliable? What's the failure rate out of the total 996 Turbo production run?

James88

Yeh............ spot on

judd944

Just as an update, I have done nothing to address the problem and everything is still working normally. 38.5k miles now

MasonWilson

Hi Judd,
I did the fixed wing set up on mine, you can check it out at the next cars and coffee. No lights if you trick the micro switches.
Mason

nick49

What did you do with the switches? With my wing removed I was fine for months then started getting the failure light at 75mph.

The first failure on my car was with the PO at about 12k miles, the whole system, rams and pump were replaced, I have the receipt. Then <19K miles the system failed again. I took the pump apart and found a wad of broken plastic that ties the 2 cylinders together. I removed everything.

My brother's '04 Turbo failed within 2 months of his purchasing the car. He had around 36K miles on it. It was CPO so he got the fix for free.

Looking at the motor and pump inside, it is overly complex, with lots of fragile components ready and waiting to fail. I'd be amazed to see a spoiler work for 100k - 150K miles without issues. I'm sure they are out there but most likely somewhat rare.

crazyfrog

by the way guys can I put some lubricant on the 2 arms lifting the wing up and down. If yes which one ?

Dock

Sure it's possible to put lubrication on the spoiler arms, though I personally wouldn't. I have never applied any lubricant to the hydraulic arms on my Turbo, and have never had any spoiler operation issues.

"02996ttx50

no one knows for sure, but it's surely enough for the problem to be well known in 996tt circles and 996tt internet forums and even referred to as "common". i'm just thinking you don't get out much. as for me, i've only had two porsche 996 turbo's and yet, oddly, spoiler issues have cropped up ( or down ) on both. just lucky i guess but we've had this conversation before. so, no matter.

though i am happy to report that a simple re-bleed of my hydraulics has proven to be trouble free to date, and they again work as they should. now 25k miles and counting. which for me is much better than the many stopgap or workaround solutions of failed or failing ( ahem ) 996t spoilers. but for those with leaking rams, or uneven deployment, there IS help and we salute you

Dock

So "No one knows for sure". That's what I thought.

And has it been established that what problems have occurred with the system were the result of one or more design failures? Or have any of the issues been the result of external factors?

Or maybe, as several have alluded to here in this thread, it's a grand scheme by those brilliant Porsche engineers to build a system that is very likely ([sic] "common") to fail JUST outside the factory warranty.

Kevinmacd

I wouldn't Extend the rams when washing and was the outside chrome part of the rams, and then dry.

"02996ttx50

it certainly wouldn't qualify as a "conspiracy" in my book. i just think they're "finicky", to use a technical term, and like any moving parts combining rubber/fluid and pumps, will be prone to issues over time. it's interesting in that porsche doesn't recommend any "maintenance" for them, per se. yet, they are filled with pentosin, which is not a "lifetime" fill i wouldn't think? so any porsche recommended fix, involves replacing the entire assembly, which is not always necessary. that kit isn't cheap, i think it was around 1700 when my first set was replaced under warranty.

any problems i've had seem to be brought about by cold weather, or low fluid, meaning a leak usually from the banjo bolt. even a banjo bolt on these left loose can leak the fluid, obviously. perhaps the seals don't like cold either. i seem to remember morton-thiokol(sp?) having trouble with an "o-ring" at low temps too. but to much greater effect, than a leaking ram

so, yeah, i'd say external factors can definitely impact the reliability and operation of our spoilers. coupled with an imperfect design, and some folks find their spoilers stop working properly. yes, it is true.

Dock

I don't know of any mechanical designs that can be labeled "perfect", as the physics of friction are a fact of life here on Earth. So of course the spoiler system falls under that ubiquitous "imperfect design" banner.

Of course there have been problems with the spoiler system on some Turbos. The issue is about defining those problems as "common".

I have no idea why some spoiler systems have problems and others (like mine) do not. Maybe some owners apply too much downward pressure on an extended wing when cleaning the car, or maybe their nice looking wife/girlfriend sat on it when posing for a picture with the car ( ). Maybe some owners use solvent/lube/soap on the extended arms and that is causing some of the problems. Maybe some owners keep the wing extended for long periods of time (while driving or while sitting in the garage...you know, the "it looks cool" approach to cars).

"02996ttx50

me either! i advise anyone that has recently become acquainted with the 996tt to be very judicious in their use of the spoiler beyond its activation at speed per its design and intended use. personally, i never even touch that manual switch, for fear it will precipitate some kind of problem. i also chuckle in dismay when seeing or hearing of anyone leaving theirs extended manually for any period of time. i know what the outcome of that will be over time. i think we can agree, they are not designed to stay "up".

i will confess, though that years ago i would sometimes drive with the older ( non hydraulically assisted? ) 993 iteration of the rear spoiler in the up position and even park it "up" for years with impunity plus it was a relatively new gimmick in the mid 90's lol.. but then i was young and foolhardy and its mechanics weren't nearly as "delicate"

i am fully confident with this re-bleed of my hydraulics though.. just not quite confident enough to part with my "fixed wing kit" from ebay yet.

MasonWilson

The switches on the passenger side of the car, mounted to the ram were removed from the ram and I covered them in a balloon and zipp tied up to the engine cover.