Dock

Yes, the Warranty and Customer Information manual establishes the "rules" as determined by PCNA. If you equate these rules with the Ten Commandments, so be it, but I associate no religious connections with the manual.

faterikcartman

You are relentlessly ignorant. Here is a quote from the California Supreme Court:
"The language of B & P C § 17200, which defines "unfair competition" to include any "unlawful, unfair, or fraudulent business practice," is intended to protect consumers as well as business competitors."

The statute is used MOSTLY in lawsuits to protect consumers and has for years.

LOOK IT UP IF YOU INSIST ON SUSPENDING REALITY.

Dock

Looks like you have an open and shut case against PCNA and the California dealers concerning warranty issues and advertising (re: pictures/posters hanging on dealers walls). I'm looking forward to seeing how this plays out in court. Keep us posted.

BC

Because you are adamantly opposed to Porsche trying to spend extra money to "keep customers happy", r.e., the "I need to return these tires" story for Nordstroms Stores and after they gave the customer his money back, the clerk says "Because we are nordstroms"

And you are from Atlanta by your admission.

One occurance is just that - an occurance. Two is a trend. Three or more posts on this thread against the common thinking (Porsche should stand behind what they market) makes you an employee.

BC

*US* meaning you and a few other executives closely watching this thread and others at the Porsche north america Headquarters in Atlanta Georgia.

Don't make me do an IP sniff.

Dock

That's just too funny.

Knock yourself out.

Dock

I've never said that.

I'm am not opposed at all to Porsche spending money to keep customers happy - they go above and beyond on plenty of issues.

BC

No, actually, regarding Porsche as a whole, this is all very very sad. Very sad indeed.

Dock

My "That's just too funny" comment was with regard to your quote I included in that post.

According to PCNA, their warranty coverage concerning "tracking/"racing" has been the same for at least the last 19 years.

BC

I understand that. I was redirecting your sad comment to the state of Porsche from the perspective of long-time Enthusiasts.

I think you underestimate the gravity of all these high net worth individuals who are continually being disappointed by this Marque.

A good opinion of a company or customer experience will be retold a few times.

A bad experience for that same customer will be retold to hundreds for years and years.

I think you truly miss the point and are ignoring what Porsche MEANS to people is why they buy. A new Corvette can blow your urbo away easily on any track and any straight line test. But people still buy Porsche, because of what it REPRESENTS.

Dock

I assure you, I understand very well.

Just out of interest - out of all the Porsches still under warranty, in your opinion how many of those owners track their Porsches?

1AS

Dock,
I've been a Porsche owner since 1980, and the tracking polcy was very different. I don't quite get your certainty about this, since your contention about its longstanding nature is directly opposite my experience.
In the 1990"s, when sales started to lag, Porsche rented tracks around the country, invited recent buyers to these tracks, had top ranked pros teach their customers how to track their (customer) cars, had their mechanics at the tracks to tend your car, and do such things as dis-enable the ABS for panic braking exercises, plus had a truckload of new Porsches for customers to drive on the track, plus had giant vehicles emblazoned PCNA at the tracks for portable classrooms and support.
All this came with a charge of $108 (or thereabouts) for a pre-track dealer inspection to make sure your pads were ok, wheels torqued, and rubber depth okay.
I have a photo of Derrik Bell, Vic Elford, and me in front of their (PCNA's) 964 turbo when I got top customer time (beaten by Bell by .1 sec). That was in my C2 cab tip. They subsequetly handled all warranty repairs on that car until I sold it, including partial reimbursement for rapid tire wear!
The current spate of denials is unquestionably a recent policy change which has taken the most loyal and long-standing customers by surprise. The sales pitch was, "this is a car that can be tracked and driven on the street." I guess you weren't at one of thise events.
When hp bumped to the 400 range, tracking got more popular, and high performance parts like pccb's began to fail, along with tires and transmissions, the liability costs increased, and PCNA policy changed. It changed while ads for PCCB's still touted their race-worthiness.
I may be one of the last beneficiaries of the old policies when my Pirellis suffered belt shift while tracking my 02X50. I explained the specific circumstances to the service manager, (that rear pressures went to 60 after 5 hard laps), and the car developed a vibration over 115 mph. Once they verified that balancing didn't help, PCNA approved 4 new tires. I don't think the service manager verified the vibration. He took my word that it occurred at the track.
Those days are over. The plethora of C4s convertible tips in Florida suggests that a huge percentage of Porsche buyers aren't performance drivers any longer, and the new policy probably is a plus for the balance sheet. I don't think guys like me any longer make up a significant part of the buying market.
Still, it's somewhat hypocritical to offer "The Porsche Driving Experience" at a race track, and later explain that you can only get that experience at the track using their cars. If you use yours, adios warranty. Out of curiosity, do those tracked 996's used for the school get sold with a warranty when they are retired after about 8,000 track miles? I suspect they have had warranties. Otherwise, who would buy those "nearly new" cars off the showroom floor?
I don't doubt that you are legaly correct. I think it's a sad statement that you probably are legally correct. I do think that many buyers now get less than they reasonably anticipated. AS

Dock

And the "legally correct" part has been my point the whole time.

faterikcartman

Go ahead and doubt Alex. Dock's already demonstrated he understands nothing about how California's consumer protection laws function.

Bob Rouleau

dock two things. One normally is made aware of the warranty post purchase. One might argue that the buyer is not properly informed. How about posting the no track statement on the walls of the dealership ..prominently displayed like the posters.

Perhaps there should be a warning label on the contract?

Secondly you asked how many cars are tracked. Probably a small percentage but they are the most enthuiastic buyers and promotors of the brand. Since they are few the cost of warranty c.laims is also low. Is dissapointing the enthusiasts a smart business decision?