Cup Car Brake Duct DIY
01-16-2009, 11:34 PM
#47
Nordschleife Master
not free-no attitude-AllanJ being sarcastic because he's jealous- I have good relationship with my parts guy- good discount- I thought cup car brake ducts would be deeper- seems same 2 1/2" deep from mounting hole. It's COLD in the garage. Gas heat or 220 V is my thoughts?
Gas for the heat. I am working on having heat installed in my garage and I am thinking gas is the way to go. Should have a contractor out here in the next week or so.
Last edited by LVDell; 01-17-2009 at 12:47 PM.
01-16-2009, 11:39 PM
#48
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Hey Steve! Dell T. from NC 
I usually dealt with Ric in the past but never for PMNA parts. Those I ordered through TRG. So....first things first. Did you order these ducts through PMNA? I was under the assumption that dealer parts dept's only have part ordering through PCNA. That might be where the mixup happened. The p/n though is correct which I find odd. IIRC, the p/n's ending in 90 are PMNA p/n's. However, I see that the GT2 has several "90" parts in the PET catalog. Now, I am throughly confused 
The p/n for the duct that he got has two p/n's on it......one is the 996turbo duct p/n (341 483) and the other is the cup p/n on a sticker.
I need a martini......
I usually dealt with Ric in the past but never for PMNA parts. Those I ordered through TRG. So....first things first. Did you order these ducts through PMNA? I was under the assumption that dealer parts dept's only have part ordering through PCNA. That might be where the mixup happened. The p/n though is correct which I find odd. IIRC, the p/n's ending in 90 are PMNA p/n's. However, I see that the GT2 has several "90" parts in the PET catalog. Now, I am throughly confused The p/n for the duct that he got has two p/n's on it......one is the 996turbo duct p/n (341 483) and the other is the cup p/n on a sticker.
I need a martini......
You're right. A lot of PMNA parts end in "90" or with a letter/number combination. If I were at work I'd show a screenshot from the GT2 brake page...the rotors are Motorsport pieces and end with something like 9H. Actually, to show an interesting point, the Motorsport GT2 rotor part numbers actually supercede to a regular non-PMNA part number. There are, in fact, a lot of parts that are shared between the Cup Cars and the regular production cars. I'm pretty sure that the brake ducts that we ordered are the same ones that you have on your car (they're the correct part number, and they really do look identical, and the regular 996T duct and the GT2/Cup one are so different looking, one could never be mistaken for the other).
Also, for many Motorsport parts, we (and any dealer) can order them through the same channels that we order regular parts. These are mainly on wear or commonly replaced items (brakes, brake spoilers, AOS, etc...). The hard part for us is getting the part number. But if we're supplied with the number we can usually get the part one way or another.
In this case, if I were to give my best guess, I would say that Porsche uses the regular 996 brake ducts (996.341.483.01) or part of it to make the larger Cup/GT2 brake ducts. That would explain the part number for the smaller ducts on the bigger ones.
Thoughts?
01-17-2009, 12:01 AM
#49
Rennlist Member
Dell, Steve - I owe you both a Martini (or whatever your liquid poison is) for jumping in here. Actually, Dell took so much money for me for the "larger steering wheel," maybe he can buy me a Coke while we're out! 
Actually, Dell took so much money for me for the "larger steering wheel," maybe he can buy me a Coke while we're out!
01-17-2009, 12:49 PM
#50
Nordschleife Master
Hey Dell! I figured that was you!
You're right. A lot of PMNA parts end in "90" or with a letter/number combination. If I were at work I'd show a screenshot from the GT2 brake page...the rotors are Motorsport pieces and end with something like 9H. Actually, to show an interesting point, the Motorsport GT2 rotor part numbers actually supercede to a regular non-PMNA part number. There are, in fact, a lot of parts that are shared between the Cup Cars and the regular production cars. I'm pretty sure that the brake ducts that we ordered are the same ones that you have on your car (they're the correct part number, and they really do look identical, and the regular 996T duct and the GT2/Cup one are so different looking, one could never be mistaken for the other).
Also, for many Motorsport parts, we (and any dealer) can order them through the same channels that we order regular parts. These are mainly on wear or commonly replaced items (brakes, brake spoilers, AOS, etc...). The hard part for us is getting the part number. But if we're supplied with the number we can usually get the part one way or another.
In this case, if I were to give my best guess, I would say that Porsche uses the regular 996 brake ducts (996.341.483.01) or part of it to make the larger Cup/GT2 brake ducts. That would explain the part number for the smaller ducts on the bigger ones.
Thoughts?
You're right. A lot of PMNA parts end in "90" or with a letter/number combination. If I were at work I'd show a screenshot from the GT2 brake page...the rotors are Motorsport pieces and end with something like 9H. Actually, to show an interesting point, the Motorsport GT2 rotor part numbers actually supercede to a regular non-PMNA part number. There are, in fact, a lot of parts that are shared between the Cup Cars and the regular production cars. I'm pretty sure that the brake ducts that we ordered are the same ones that you have on your car (they're the correct part number, and they really do look identical, and the regular 996T duct and the GT2/Cup one are so different looking, one could never be mistaken for the other).
Also, for many Motorsport parts, we (and any dealer) can order them through the same channels that we order regular parts. These are mainly on wear or commonly replaced items (brakes, brake spoilers, AOS, etc...). The hard part for us is getting the part number. But if we're supplied with the number we can usually get the part one way or another.
In this case, if I were to give my best guess, I would say that Porsche uses the regular 996 brake ducts (996.341.483.01) or part of it to make the larger Cup/GT2 brake ducts. That would explain the part number for the smaller ducts on the bigger ones.
Thoughts?
01-17-2009, 09:04 PM
#51
Rennlist Member
Does anyone have a picture of the Cup car duct they can post (or send me and I'll post)? It would appear that Dell's picture and mine are very similar (from the angles taken), so perhaps it would be good to see what the real Cup duct looks like......
01-17-2009, 10:07 PM
#53
I measured 2 1/2 " from mounting hole to bottom of duct- It looks like less ground clearance in AllanJ's picture but that is based on ride height- and my car is low- Opitcal illusion? I'm going to install new brake duct and be done with it! Plumber could probably just add a zone on gas heating system or extention- I'm trying to figure that out also. Heat in garage might extend my tire life?
01-18-2009, 01:27 AM
#54
Rennlist Member
So pardon my artistic skils, but here's this evenings attempt. To summarize:
-Both are about the same heigth, or at least close enough to be negligible
-The original part had a longer "nose" forward of the "push bolt" hole, but actually shorter overall before the primary cross section
-The replacement part is actually thicker along the bottom initially, but then tapers and becomes thinner than the original part the further back you travel
-The original part has a thicker middle cross section/"ledge" by about double
It's as if the new pieces gets more air intiially, then loses the ability to direct it; while the older piece does a better job of channeling the air all the way to the disc.
So what does the solve? Unless we get a Cup duct, I'm not sure what we're learned.....
BTW: The duct shown in post #16 appears to be a good angle shot at the replacemet part in my pictures.
-Both are about the same heigth, or at least close enough to be negligible
-The original part had a longer "nose" forward of the "push bolt" hole, but actually shorter overall before the primary cross section
-The replacement part is actually thicker along the bottom initially, but then tapers and becomes thinner than the original part the further back you travel
-The original part has a thicker middle cross section/"ledge" by about double
It's as if the new pieces gets more air intiially, then loses the ability to direct it; while the older piece does a better job of channeling the air all the way to the disc.
So what does the solve? Unless we get a Cup duct, I'm not sure what we're learned.....
BTW: The duct shown in post #16 appears to be a good angle shot at the replacemet part in my pictures.
03-28-2009, 12:04 PM
#55
I guess that i am reviving an semi-old thread, but...what was the resolution with all this? Or is there one? I posted some stuff on my breaks (yes the dreaded pccb, pun intended)and made some comment about how i still have a tough time believing that they make a difference, so i searched again. I had come across this thread before, but not page 3-4 intiially so i had not been aware of the debate over the parts themselves. the pertinent stuff was buried deep in the thread.
Last year, I read that the cup ducts were superior, found the part number (old posts here), ordered them and got a duct that looked just like the ones in the photos Same part numbers. They really did not look like much more than the original ducts so i did not put the on originally and figured that WHEN (not if) i rip the old ones off on something i will have a replacement, they are consumables afterall. Then i read more posts about how superior they are, so i decided to put them on. Maybe the shape and actual dimensions are deceiving and they in fact do channel more air and provide better cooling than the shape would suggest. Has anyone taken brake temps before and after the modification. I have my old ones and i guess i could do the experiment once i get a pyrometer... (on my list!)
Here are some pictures for comparison. I guess that the cup duct sticks down a little more, i use my imagination... i tried to photograph from the same angle (original up top, the cup in photo below). I also put them one on top of the other.
fve
Last year, I read that the cup ducts were superior, found the part number (old posts here), ordered them and got a duct that looked just like the ones in the photos Same part numbers. They really did not look like much more than the original ducts so i did not put the on originally and figured that WHEN (not if) i rip the old ones off on something i will have a replacement, they are consumables afterall. Then i read more posts about how superior they are, so i decided to put them on. Maybe the shape and actual dimensions are deceiving and they in fact do channel more air and provide better cooling than the shape would suggest. Has anyone taken brake temps before and after the modification. I have my old ones and i guess i could do the experiment once i get a pyrometer... (on my list!)
Here are some pictures for comparison. I guess that the cup duct sticks down a little more, i use my imagination... i tried to photograph from the same angle (original up top, the cup in photo below). I also put them one on top of the other.
fve
03-28-2009, 12:13 PM
#56
whoops, now i find this. I guess that is what happens when info is spread out amongst different threads. I all depends on how you do your search... this time i put in the part number. Mystery solved, i guess.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 94Speedster
Then I would assume that they would have the "997" first three number designations...
Not sure John - maybe others (ViperBob, etc.) could chime in...
-Blake
Chiming in here...
Blake's right, they are 996 Cup ducts.
The numbers are "casting" numbers, they are basically numbers once sent to the manufacturer who molded the main parts for Porsche prior to them being customized by Motorsport.
You'll find this on your wheel carriers (uprights) also, the number molded onto them by Brembo(as I recall) in Italy (where they're made - they have excellent Aluminum abilities in Italy, that's a whole 'nother story about Lamborghini and Ferrari in a pissing contest for sand castings) is several digits different than the number in the parts film produced by Porsche.
The disparity between casting number, cataloged number, and sticker label / invoice part number is normal, think nothing of it, you have the right parts for a 996 GT3, they are indeed Cup brake ducts.
__________________
Austin
...likes to go fast
Quote:
Originally Posted by 94Speedster
Then I would assume that they would have the "997" first three number designations...
Not sure John - maybe others (ViperBob, etc.) could chime in...
-Blake
Chiming in here...
Blake's right, they are 996 Cup ducts.
The numbers are "casting" numbers, they are basically numbers once sent to the manufacturer who molded the main parts for Porsche prior to them being customized by Motorsport.
You'll find this on your wheel carriers (uprights) also, the number molded onto them by Brembo(as I recall) in Italy (where they're made - they have excellent Aluminum abilities in Italy, that's a whole 'nother story about Lamborghini and Ferrari in a pissing contest for sand castings) is several digits different than the number in the parts film produced by Porsche.
The disparity between casting number, cataloged number, and sticker label / invoice part number is normal, think nothing of it, you have the right parts for a 996 GT3, they are indeed Cup brake ducts.
__________________
Austin
...likes to go fast
06-18-2009, 02:01 PM
#57
Rennlist Member
around the last turn onto the pit straight and having to dodge what looked
like the rear taillight from a 996 ...
I thought to myself "poor bastard..."
it then occurred to me that this taillight was from the left side and I had recently
removed my own unit to access the engine compartment release cable which is hidden behind it ... (on my '99 996 GT3 mkI CS)
Well ... indeed it was my taillight ... the screw had worked loose and it had silented "baled out" on the previous lap!
06-18-2009, 02:15 PM
#58
Rennlist Member
Hey Dell! I figured that was you!
You're right. A lot of PMNA parts end in "90" or with a letter/number combination. If I were at work I'd show a screenshot from the GT2 brake page...the rotors are Motorsport pieces and end with something like 9H. Actually, to show an interesting point, the Motorsport GT2 rotor part numbers actually supercede to a regular non-PMNA part number. There are, in fact, a lot of parts that are shared between the Cup Cars and the regular production cars. I'm pretty sure that the brake ducts that we ordered are the same ones that you have on your car (they're the correct part number, and they really do look identical, and the regular 996T duct and the GT2/Cup one are so different looking, one could never be mistaken for the other).
Also, for many Motorsport parts, we (and any dealer) can order them through the same channels that we order regular parts. These are mainly on wear or commonly replaced items (brakes, brake spoilers, AOS, etc...). The hard part for us is getting the part number. But if we're supplied with the number we can usually get the part one way or another.
In this case, if I were to give my best guess, I would say that Porsche uses the regular 996 brake ducts (996.341.483.01) or part of it to make the larger Cup/GT2 brake ducts. That would explain the part number for the smaller ducts on the bigger ones.
Thoughts?
You're right. A lot of PMNA parts end in "90" or with a letter/number combination. If I were at work I'd show a screenshot from the GT2 brake page...the rotors are Motorsport pieces and end with something like 9H. Actually, to show an interesting point, the Motorsport GT2 rotor part numbers actually supercede to a regular non-PMNA part number. There are, in fact, a lot of parts that are shared between the Cup Cars and the regular production cars. I'm pretty sure that the brake ducts that we ordered are the same ones that you have on your car (they're the correct part number, and they really do look identical, and the regular 996T duct and the GT2/Cup one are so different looking, one could never be mistaken for the other).
Also, for many Motorsport parts, we (and any dealer) can order them through the same channels that we order regular parts. These are mainly on wear or commonly replaced items (brakes, brake spoilers, AOS, etc...). The hard part for us is getting the part number. But if we're supplied with the number we can usually get the part one way or another.
In this case, if I were to give my best guess, I would say that Porsche uses the regular 996 brake ducts (996.341.483.01) or part of it to make the larger Cup/GT2 brake ducts. That would explain the part number for the smaller ducts on the bigger ones.
Thoughts?
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rocket930 (11-19-2022)
07-13-2009, 02:00 PM
#59
God I am so confused... I just lost my rear GT2 brake duct, after a convo with a gt3 cup guy too that was telling me to get the 997 cup ducts as they were 20 bucks a piece instead of 200+ for the 996 cup ducts LOL, just my luck!
So anyway, after doing tons of research now, I am seeing my GT2 ducts are indeed already shared with the gt3 cup ducts, is this correct? Is that front and rear? I don't know what to do, order, replace, etc :/
Martin
So anyway, after doing tons of research now, I am seeing my GT2 ducts are indeed already shared with the gt3 cup ducts, is this correct? Is that front and rear? I don't know what to do, order, replace, etc :/
Martin
07-13-2009, 02:11 PM
#60
Rennlist Member
God I am so confused... I just lost my rear GT2 brake duct, after a convo with a gt3 cup guy too that was telling me to get the 997 cup ducts as they were 20 bucks a piece instead of 200+ for the 996 cup ducts LOL, just my luck!
So anyway, after doing tons of research now, I am seeing my GT2 ducts are indeed already shared with the gt3 cup ducts, is this correct? Is that front and rear? I don't know what to do, order, replace, etc :/
Martin
So anyway, after doing tons of research now, I am seeing my GT2 ducts are indeed already shared with the gt3 cup ducts, is this correct? Is that front and rear? I don't know what to do, order, replace, etc :/
Martin
apparently the 997 cup *front* ducts are the same as those on the 997.1
street car, and are in fact around $20 each, they are also, as they say in
the trade "teeny tiny" ...
AFIAK there are "no" rear ducts on the 997.1 GT3 to speak of, which has
recently been rectified by the new 997.2 which does have such ducts, and
those may be retrofitted to the 997.1 GT3 (see my thread on this in the 997
GT3 forum).
I dont know if these ducts can be retrofitted to either a 996/7 GT2 ...
hope this helps