rpm's S2

Latest Excellence (June 2011) tech forum recommends changing to a 'boutique' oil for M96 engined cars because the mass-market producers are reducing the levels of the high-pressure additives Zinc Dialkyl Dithio Phosphates (ZDDP) and Sulphated Ash/Phosphorous/Sulphue (SAPS) in their formulations. The authors note that they are "seeing more problems with wear on the internal engine mechanical systems, specifically in the area of the valvetrain."

This is a fairly major change of direction from the traditional, "use Porsche-approved synthetic lubricants" party line that I have heard and followed for years. I read some previous Rennlist discussions on the topic (none on any boards that feature M96-engined cars interestingly), but they were older posts and none had such a specific recommendation from a reliable source.

One last... I did not fail to notice that the article was placed adjacent to a ZIMS Autotechnik ad that featured Brad Penn oil prominently and specifically mentioned ZDDP. I'm not suspicious, but just saying...

So, thoughts? Experience with boutique oils? I'm certainly aware of some of the brands, but never considered switching.

nick49

Brad Penn could possibly be the best oil currently available aside from possibly fouling cats from the heavy metal content. Brad Penn is the same oil, same prime 100% pure Pennsylvania base stock, same refinery, as the original Kendall motor oil when is was owned by the oil additive maker Witco Chemical. Kendall oils were a favorite amongst racers of all types, from Porsche roadracing to motorcycles and everything in between. Hondaline and Harley-Davidson motor oils were private labled Kendall before they decided to go with the lowest contract bidder. At least half of all racers at Speedweek on the Bonneville Salt were using Kendall. I used it exclusively for over 10 years racing and sold it since the '70s. When it got bought out by Conoco-Phillips the recipe changed and it's no longer the same stuff.

Most all motorcycle manufacturers warn against using automotive oils in their products as expensive motor damage can result. This is becaus the absence of ZDDP and other sacrificial alloys.

philooo

what about those fancy brand like royal purple stuff ? any ZDDP in there ?

ivangene

I am running Brad Penn, but will go back to what I had in the 996 (Quaker Q Horse Power) based on my indies recommendation even in the older cars. There is only one grade that works and is Euro spec, the rest are not - IIRC its the 10/40 but I could be wrong - its whatever he carries. Dyno results show significant change simply by changing the oil....numbers dont lie, he runs it in the 356, 73S and the 11' GT3RS

pesuazo

Mobil 1 10W-40 High Mileage and Mobil 1 5W-40 Turbo Diesel have ZDDP and SAPS also (they are both SL rated).

I have been running a mixture of the 2 in my Mercedes for a while.

In my last oil change, did the same to the 996 (6 quarts of the high mileage and 4 quarts of the Diesel)

Mobil 1 5W-40 Turbo Diesel
Chemical Name CAS Number Typical Value
PHOSPHORODITHOIC ACID, O,O-DI C1-14-ALKYL ESTERS, ZINC SALTS (2:1) (ZDDP) 68649-42-3 < 2.5%
Phosporous (ASTM D4951) 0.11
HTHS Viscosity, mPa•s @ 150ºC (ASTM D4683) 3.8
Sulfated Ash, wt% (ASTM D874) 0.95
API CJ-4, CI-4 PLUS/CI-4/CH-4/CG-4/ SM/SL/SJ


Applications
Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Truck 5W-40 is recommended for use in all super high performance diesel applications, including modern low emission engine designs with Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR). These applications include the following:

•On-highway engines operating in both high speed/high load and stop-and-go conditions
•Off-highway engines operating in severe low speed/heavy load conditions
•Virtually all diesel powered equipment from American, European, and Japanese equipment builders
•High performance gasoline engines and mixed fleets

ivangene

Cocktail Time

pesuazo

LOL...., and do it while having a rum and coke !!!

ivangene

OH YEA..... Duffman is in the house !!

Barn996

Now you are talking...mine with Bacardi please, hold the lime.

jrgordonsenior

I race on Amsoil 15-50 Dominator Race Oil.... http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/rd50.aspx

Marc Gelefsky

I love a good oil thread in the Morning! Lubricates like Victory!

Quadcammer

motul 300v is probably one of the best oils out there in terms of shear and ZDDP. But its expensive and needs to be changed frequently.

Most of the air cooled 993TT guys are now running either that or mobil Vtwin 20w-50

Flat6 Innovations

I learned long ago that the root of some of the issues that we see with the engine are oil related, especially on-track.

I teamed up with Joe Gibbs Racing Oils and now we receive drums of our own blend of "Flat 6 Oil" which goes in every one of our reconstructed engines. I recently finished the 5-40 grade and we are awaiting the first production run of that to be delivered to us after testing it in our engines for over a year

Standard off the shelf oils did not give me the same used oil analysis that we see from a purpose formulated anti-wear and detergency package. I found that off the shelf oils did not perform as well as the elevated oil temperatures that the M96 engine is known for. After we found the right package the rattles at start up were gone, hot operating oil pressures were higher and engines held better oil pressure on the track.

You must be careful with running oils with high zinc and phosphorous that work better in vintage engines, they kill O2 sensors and catalytic converters.

This is a hot topic and because of that I haven't been selling these products. I did the development to round off our engine program, so don't get the wrong idea thinking that I am here to sell you oil, because we have no plans to market it to the public at the present time.

AudiOn19s

another 5+ page oil thread...

When I had my 996 I ran Redline 5w-40 in it exclusively. I'm a firm believer in quality lubricants.

pesuazo

My favorite is Bacardi Limon, hence no need for the lime, but I will make yours with Bacardi Gold, no lime....
I am getting thirsty already.....