himself

As you noted, the rounded lip in the stock baffle effectively closes the baffle, but it also illustrates that there is a reduced amount of oil available in the "pocket."

Also, now that I look at this closer, I'm not convinced there is actually a huge flow path between the sections in the stock pan, i.e., point number 3 may be slightly embellished (picture number 4). The small metal tab appears to dovetail to some degree with the block and may actually prevent some oil from flowing between the halves.

However, to the extent there is a separate flow path, oil will take the path of least resistance during hard cornering, which may contribute to starvation issues.

Fair point. Although there is no gasket, it looks to me like the flat edge of the baffle is pretty close. I have no idea if oil actually flows around the back side, but given the rest of the design, I would expect little if any.

On the X51 the baffles are manufactured to stay open. Although it may be minimal, it reduces the resistance to oil flowing into the baffle area. On the stock pan, the baffles are close all the time. This extra resistance may discourage oil from entering the pocket.

Actually, the holes are little higher on the X51, probably to closer match the pickup location (i.e., to better match the pickup depth). This may also affect the deep sump pan you mentioned.

No worries. I'm not a Porsche engineer. It just made sense to me when I researched it. Like I said, it could be all wrong and your engine might blow up


If you get the deep sump, you should consider the extended oil pickup since the deep sump moves the bottom of the oil pan away from the oil pickup. Under extreme cornering you could exacerbate the starvation issue. That is, there is substantially more oil in the pan, but not necessarily substantially more in the baffle area. There have been a number of discussions on this, but who really knows if it makes it better or worse...

Ultimately, to benefit from the X51 oil pan, you probably need all the other X51 parts, or just get a new engine altogether

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Lastly, those that are even considering this are probably track junkies anyway. And we all know that $250 is nothing in the grand scheme of tracking a 911. If you don't track your car, you probably don't need this mod.
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-td

Dervish

Haha, great!

Totally take your points though and it's always good to get a fresh pair of eyes on something. Like I said I ended up fitting the pan which without the full X51 kit may just be a waste of money but hopefully it will help prevent 'something' happening???

redridge

The x51 is also 4 sided once it is installed, the gaskets are mated to the engine wall (thus holding more oil in the baffled area). When you installed the x51 pan, have you noticed extra resistance... that is the gaskets sealing up inside the engine wall.


I also looked at the 2 design... in fact the pics that were posted are mine....
oil starvation were never an issue with these cars... unless you are tracking with slicks. the water cooled guy Ryner? at the PCA site stated that they never seen any oil starvation incident/problem... it was just one of the 996 myth. The x51 is def a better design...bottom line... it holds more oil within the baffles.

the prob with this setup is yes... it extends the oil capacity but in the wrong direction. What good is it making it deeper if the oil pickup cant reach the oil.... if there were a pickup extension then it would be better

himself

Nice pans Red Those pics are getting some good mileage - thanks!

FWIW, I pull 1.6+ LatGs and 1.4+ longGs running R6s. So far no engine kaboom. But my last engine did kaboom running RA1s. No confimed diagnosis as to whether it was oiling or not. Maybe Raby knows the answer

-td

Paul 996

Red is spot on.. The x51 has a rubber seal on both the front and rear. No question about it. It creates a much bigger box for the oil to sit inside of.


Also, extremely vital is that openings on the doors sit significantly higher than the stock baffle... BTW the parts department calls this thing a "windage" tray.

Also +1 on the Negative for the BK. what it does is just plain friggin wrong. It lifts the baffle up but leaves an open gap all along the bottom.. Where does the oil go? DUh to BK.

Mantis has the only other good solution in that they extend just like BK does but seal while extending and then drop the oil pick back down by the same amount. Ie you carry more oil and your oil pickup sits deeper w/i that pool of oil.

redridge

another note.... the only way that the oil can move from side to side (high G's) of the x51 pan is through the side 3 holes...

the stock pan use plastic tabs to keep the flaps in place... the x51 pan use rivits... When I pulled the stock pan out, I found 2 plastic tabs that hold the flaps at the bottom of the pan... the plastic tabs are cheap... if the rest of the tabs wouldve totally failed... the flaps would of failed and oil starvation is imminent.

Dervish

I agree on all points mentioned. It all makes sense.

I'm sure I read in the BK install instructions that there was an extension to the oil pick up but reading it again there isn't so feeling the same about that kit as you guys.

Redridge, yup, your photos, was following your threads on 6speed...

Jake Raby

I'll post a few really interesting pics next week...

And it doesn't include rubber oil control windows...

Ahmet

Data points:

I have noticed in several 996s that extended sweepers (Roebling Road for example) will have the oil pressure drop a couple of bars as per the gauge on stick street tires. I'm at Thunderbolt right now, and I've seen it go as low as 2 bar on the gauge on a long enough sweeper. I'd seen close to 1 at Roebling. I only notice it at the exit of turn 2 at VIR full.

Anybody do a before/after with this pan?

Also out of curiosity, does anybody care to explain what exactly it means to have lower pressure as per the gauge? Does that mean the pick up gets partially uncovered, and pockets of air enter the oil supply?

rob76turbo

LN Engineering has a pick up tube extension that works with the BK kit. Or you can just buy theirs and it comes with the extension.

http://www.lnengineering.com/deepsump.html

Question though, the install video for the LN / Flat 6 kit mentions that you have to modify the stock plastic oil baffle. You use a Dremel to extend the lower edge of the 3 "windows" on each side. So if you go with both the X51 and the LN or BK deep sump kit do you have to extend the "windows" on the metal X51 baffle too? Jake, have you seen this combo on a car?

007DT

How easy of a DIY is this? And because I'm lazy what is the cost of the X51 Pan?

rob76turbo

$199.95 at Sun Coast. I think it is a direct R&R for the 996 and requires a bit of trimming for the 986. Looks pretty staight forward.

CornerCarver

What did you get us into?!?

Brian A.

I did this on my 99 996. It was a breeze plus I had the opportunity to get a look at my sump and oil pickup.

007DT

I know.. I feel like I have a live granade in my car.