MechanicalEng

I partially agree with you.. as I said in my post "I agree that the feedback and the Feeling of the Boxster is superior and the brakes are better" I do recognize that overall the 986 is more refined..
About the SCCA Classification please read it again, it has changed... now us 996's have to race against SRT-10 Vipers...

Here is a link
http://www.moutons.org/sccasolo/Lists/2006/stockc.html

Benjamin Choi

LOL Ray man... talk about driving with blinders on let me cross-post this sucker

Ray S

Brilliant idea....

Let's bring a whole bunch of 16 year olds from Honda Tech and S2Ki over here and we can really raise the bar on this discussion....

They can go on to tell us why the NSX is the best sports car ever made...

How about YOU address some of the negatives I raised about the S2000 (rather than bring a teenage posse over)? If the car is so fast and powerful, why did you feel the need to supercharge yours? Why did you trade up to an E46 M3 and then trade up again to a 996?

Man up Ben, don't bring some kids over to fight your battle.

Ray S

Man or Mouse Ben???

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=505946

Ray S

Agreed, that is why I wrote "was" classed in B with the Boxster back when the Boxster had 217, the S2000 had 240 (237), and the BS had 250.

hwk72

We don't need additional 16 year olds, we have Ben - he counts for 10. "Ben - 10": that's even a rhyme.

Benjamin Choi

you Porsche cheerleader you Ray - just sit back and enjoy man - I think it's absolutely hilarious you post top speed as a negative LOL are you kidding me bud? And hey, nice internet sleuthing. You get a cookie for that one. Now you can thug out and tell them directly exactly what you think of S2000 and the stereotypes you put on them owners being 16 and whatever you got concocted.

I like the Boxster S and think it's a fantastic car. Heck, I wave at them drivers just as I wave at the 911 drivers on the Seattle roads over here. But to pounce on the S2000 and call it a performance joke is... esp when you own the regular Boxster is... well. hilarious.

Ray S

Ah Ben, still have not answered any on my S2000 negs.

- The brakes - Single Piston and relatively small. If you took your old S2000 to the track I'm sure your familiar with the term "fade".
- The handling - The AP2 is not quite as spooky as the AP1, but neither car is up to Boxster specs
- The power - fantastic above 6k, but a dog under that. (I've driven Civics that feel spunkier down low.)
- The dash - Did I miss a memo, is Atari cool again?
- Radio - Don't make me go there...
- Wheels - I know how you love your steamrollers on the 996, AP1's roll on 16's
- Interior - Miles of hard black plastic
- Storage space - Not why any of us buy a sports car, but it would be nice to carry more than a duffle.
- Engine sound - Not bad for the first 5 minutes behind the wheel hitting VTEC. But tiresome over the long haul and a poor subsitute vs a Porsche flat six.
- Finally, the drive - Every time I've been behind the wheel of an S2K, it seems like every car with stickers and a fart can exhaust wants to play Fast 'n Furious with me (sorry street racing is just not my thing, that's what race tracks are for)

I'm not trying to be mean and I honestly like the car (just not as much as a Boxster). It really is a shame that Honda didn't continue to develop the S2000 with the same level of continual upgrades Porsche gave the Boxster.

Ray S

Why would I want to do that? They obviously like their cars. Flame wars between boards are pretty childish don't you think?

Never said it's a joke. In fact, I believe I said it's actually quicker than a base Boxster.

What I would say is that neither car is a very good dragster (sure you can get to 60 in under 6 seconds in an S2000 IF you could care less about your clutch). What they both do well is handle.......except the Boxster does it better, IMHO.

PedalFaster

Wow -- lots of factual errors being made here.

Some background: I currently own a 2003 986S with the M030 suspension, and it's the best car I've ever owned. I also owned an S2000 for two years, and owned a 2000 986S before that. I have multiple national-level SCCA autocross trophies to my name, have a decent amount of track experience, am the author of the S2000 autocross setup FAQ, and was formerly on the SCCA's Stock Advisory Committee (the group responsible for autocross classing of stock cars). So I know a little bit about both the S2000 and the 986S, and how they perform when pushed to their limits.

Firstly, the previous differences in autocross classification proves nothing. The SAC initially thought the 986S should be faster than the S2000, but were proven wrong when B Stock S2000s were regularly matching A Stock Corvette and Boxster S times. That's why the S2000 was moved up to AS -- it was clearly a match for the other AS cars, including the Boxster S. Since being moved to AS, the S2000 has enjoyed much more success than the Boxster. For example, at last year's national championships, the top S2000 placed second, while the top Boxster S (driven by a former national champion who had won a different class' ProSolo title earlier that week) was 1.6 seconds back -- an eternity in autocross. I personally think the Boxster can get the job done, which is part of the reason I'm driving one this year, but almost all of the autocross data to date indicates that the S2000 is at least a match for, if not better than, the Boxster S.

Secondly, handling is a subjective criterion, and although I personally prefer the Boxster's handling, it's not obviously the better handling car. The Boxster has much better steering feel, and is more forgiving at the limits, but the S2000's handling has a directness that no other road car could match until the Elise came along. It's spectacularly quick in transitions, which is a big part of the reason why it's a match for the more powerful Boxster in autocross.

Lastly, you're calling out a bunch of things which are subjective at best, and completely irrelevant at worst. Who cares if the S2000 has steel suspension as long as it works well? Do you ever hit your car's top speed, and even if you do, does the ability to go a few miles per hour faster or slower make or break a car for you?

It's obvious you've made up your mind and have no intention of changing it (calling Honda owners the Fast and Furious 16 year-old set wasn't exactly classy), but hopefully my post will prevent others from taking your word as fact.

TD in DC

Nice post pedal faster.

I like 'em both myself.

I view autocross as significantly different than DE and racing.

For DEs and/or racing, I personally would prefer the Boxster S.

Just my two cents.

Benjamin Choi

Bud, you're just digging a deeper hole. My point is, the S2000 is a fantastic car as is the Boxster S (not even going to mention the Boxster) and are very competitive to each other.

Admit it, you're being a Boxster cheerleader and it's making you look like you wear Porsche panties, honestly.

TD in DC

Looks to me like you are simply enjoying sticking Ray with a fork.

If you wanted to have an interesting conversation, you could respond to the factual assertions Ray made . . .

BruceP

Great post, PedalFaster.

Benjamin Choi

Read what he wrote up. I'm hardly sticking anything to anyone.

He stuck a trite, heavily biased fork into this thread and even went so far as to throw nonsensical stereotypes against the S2000 and its owners. Sweet.

Sounds like you aren't actually reading but instead conveniently skimming and giving him the benefit of the doubt in this thread. All I'm saying is, don't be so elementary and put down a car because it has single piston brakes that flat out work? C'mon, bro. I guess I just expected more of Rennlist/track vet like Ray S. Perhaps this is where I went wrong?

I just did and I did you guys one better by having someone much more credible than I from the performance perspective share his thoughts (voluntarily, mind you).

I kinda knew what he was going to say all along, but it just means so much more when coming from the horse's mouth - an accomplished horse at that.