Tires: How old is too old for basic use?
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Rennlist Member
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From: Evergreen, CO
Tires: How old is too old for basic use?
I'm aware of the conventional wisdom that tires more than 4-5 years should be replaced, but I'm hoping for a practical dialogue to better understand the reasons for this practice.
I have a set of 19" lobster forks shod in a set of Michelin Pilot Sports with 2006 date codes. The tires have excellent tread, but I'm sure the rubber is quite stiff.
I certainly wouldn't track them in an HPDE, but what about a trip to the autocross? Toodling around town? Highway speeds?
Is the risk a sudden catastrophic failure, or is it more about a greasy, hard rubber sensation, longer braking distance, and squirrelly handling? Combination of these? Something else?
I'm trying to understand the specific reasons to retire old rubber. I don't really plan to run these wheels until I get them refinished and new tires fitted anyway, but this forum is a deep well of knowledge, so I hope to learn something new.
I have a set of 19" lobster forks shod in a set of Michelin Pilot Sports with 2006 date codes. The tires have excellent tread, but I'm sure the rubber is quite stiff.
I certainly wouldn't track them in an HPDE, but what about a trip to the autocross? Toodling around town? Highway speeds?
Is the risk a sudden catastrophic failure, or is it more about a greasy, hard rubber sensation, longer braking distance, and squirrelly handling? Combination of these? Something else?
I'm trying to understand the specific reasons to retire old rubber. I don't really plan to run these wheels until I get them refinished and new tires fitted anyway, but this forum is a deep well of knowledge, so I hope to learn something new.
Pro
Joined: Sep 2021
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https://www.thedrive.com/article/518...rs-fatal-crash
I'm going to pick up a car tomorrow with tires from 2013. I'm not worried about driving it home but tires will be the first thing done. Autocross, no way.
I'm going to pick up a car tomorrow with tires from 2013. I'm not worried about driving it home but tires will be the first thing done. Autocross, no way.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2015
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I bought my "still" new to me 1999 back in November with full tread tires but from 2016. They are hard, rough, and feel like sliding around on plastic. I only have them on still as getting items sorted out - plus going to swap to new wheels shortly. But there's no reason to save a few bucks and drive unsafe tires.
Rennlist Member
Joined: Dec 2020
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From: Miami
We’d swap out or tire inventory every year when I worked for Lexus back in the day and we couldn’t sell tires older than 3yrs old from vendors. I would probably consider them as a spare and limited highway use. Honestly the sidewalls will be more susceptible to damage due to put holes and alike. I don’t think tire separation would be an issue at low speeds but wouldn’t do much if any highway travel.
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jul 2017
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From: Waynesville, NC
Tires harden as the rubber begins to lose the volatile gases that affect the tire's compound. This generally starts as soon as the protective coating is scrubbed off at first use. The rate of rubber hardening can be affected by the type of exposure. A tire with lots of miles on a car that sits outside, exposed to temps and sunlight, may easily be toast in 4 years, where a tire with lower use stored in a protected garage might logically have a longer safe life.
My 996 bought last year came with Pilot Sports with 2015 date codes, but were purchased and installed at a Michelin dealer in 2018, garage-stored, and have about 5000-6000 miles on them. They still stick like they should, and I consider them completely safe for road use, but will likely replace in 12-18 months.
It's also worth noting that the normal standard for HPDE events is a tire manufacture date of 4 years or less. Since this age standard applies to high speed events, clearly tires don't disintegrate at 4 1/2 years.
Just another perspective....
My 996 bought last year came with Pilot Sports with 2015 date codes, but were purchased and installed at a Michelin dealer in 2018, garage-stored, and have about 5000-6000 miles on them. They still stick like they should, and I consider them completely safe for road use, but will likely replace in 12-18 months.
It's also worth noting that the normal standard for HPDE events is a tire manufacture date of 4 years or less. Since this age standard applies to high speed events, clearly tires don't disintegrate at 4 1/2 years.
Just another perspective....
Last edited by RWPinNC; Feb 2, 2023 at 07:20 AM.
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Rennlist Member
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From: Illinois
Certainly wouldn't canyon carve or track an old set of tires. But don't think for a minute you aren't at risk locally on the hwy or street with either less grip or rubber that is brittle.
good rubber + good brakes = good outcomes
good rubber + good brakes = good outcomes
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Rennlist Member
Joined: Oct 2009
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From: Over Yonder
From Michelin's web site:
"While most tires will need replacement before they achieve 10 years, it is recommended that any tires in service 10 years or more from the date of manufacture, including spare tires, be replaced with new tires as a simple precaution even if such tires appear serviceable and even if they have not reached the legal wear limit."
"While most tires will need replacement before they achieve 10 years, it is recommended that any tires in service 10 years or more from the date of manufacture, including spare tires, be replaced with new tires as a simple precaution even if such tires appear serviceable and even if they have not reached the legal wear limit."
Three Wheelin'
Joined: May 2019
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From: USA/Oregon
You can buy a Durometer gage from various racing parts and equipment sites, you can see how hard the tires are compared to new.
I've seen 2 year old tires that hard already dried out and were hard as a rock.
I've seen 2 year old tires that hard already dried out and were hard as a rock.
Rennlist Member
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,814
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From: Over Yonder
Interesting thread here:
Tire Date Code - Sale Date - Rennlist - Porsche Discussion Forums
Kind of like oil threads, many of them out there.
Tire Date Code - Sale Date - Rennlist - Porsche Discussion Forums
Kind of like oil threads, many of them out there.
Rennlist Member
Joined: May 2015
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From: Edmonton, AB
I've got a set of 10 year old winters that my Turbo is currently sitting on in the garage, but my plan is to replace them this year.
I'm trying to replace at 6-8 years, but since I basically only do limited driving on all my cars, I'm okay keeping them on a teeny bit longer...if they look good and feel good and check out. Any cracks or anything - gone.
I'm trying to replace at 6-8 years, but since I basically only do limited driving on all my cars, I'm okay keeping them on a teeny bit longer...if they look good and feel good and check out. Any cracks or anything - gone.
