I want to pick the brains on those few lucky ones who have driven both. I'm particularly interested in the differences between the two cars in terms of handling and driving dynamics, especially in spirited driving situation like on a track.
I would tend to think the 993 would be more docile as its rear suspension is an evolution of the 964 model. So relatively speaking, the RS America would tend to throw its tail end out during high speed cornering and seems to be less stable. Well, of course, that would probably turn into an advantage in the hands of the skilled drivers :-)
Personally, I have never driven a P-car before. Can someone tell me how does it feel or handle in corners versus a more traditional layout like front engine-rear wheel drive or even mid engine setup.
TIA.

 

[quote]Originally posted by pete325:
<strong>Personally, I have never driven a P-car before. Can someone tell me how does it feel or handle in corners versus a more traditional layout like front engine-rear wheel drive or even mid engine setup.
TIA.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Pete, welcome to the list!

While I cannot offer you a direct answer to your comparison you are asking, I can give you my feedback for the above portion of your question.
Like most of us I was used to front engine front wheel or rear wheel drive cars. My last 3 Porsche cars were all front engine rear drive. With my last front engine ( 968) I started exploring her limits on the track. Like most mortals I always wanted a 911. But since I heard so much about tails hanging out etc, I was thinking of keeping with the front engined cars. That is until I rode in my instuctors 965 Turbo and that experience changed my viewpoint...so I took the plunge! Going from driving hard for 16 years with the traditional layout the move to my 993 was an eye opening experience. Initially I thought that it was a huge mistake moving into my 993 , now I cannot imagine driving another car ever! At first I got scared, confused as I was getting very different signals from the car than all my previous experiences. The front is light, direct and at first you miss all your turn in points as the response is much quicker than before. The brakes are phenomenal and feel like you droped an anchor! Then the weight on the back is something unusual, if you drive the stock suspension you get some strange movements that you never experience before. Many including myself have discribed this experience as unsettling and a worn suspension will magnify this like in my case. Since I changed my suspension then the dynamics of the design are evident. Throttle steering is more prominent(needed) and the thing that still floors me is that when I feel I'm on the limit of adhesion and I start drifting, I press the throttle against everything my brain says and that settles the back so nicely that it still amazes me. I dont throw the car in the corners like I did with my 968. Probably my skill is not to that point yet, but being smooth with the steering and the throttle is a very rewarding experience on the 993. On the limit I have found that it is progressive and it gives me plenty of warning..you just have to learn the signals and this will happen only with putting miles on the car at a race track. Still the mortal mistake of throttle lifting while cornering on the limit is there, maybe not as pronounced as in older 911 designs but still there. I guess my final advise would be to buy the car and progressively built more speed with it. As you learn you will go faster and the grin on your face will become harder and harder to wipe off!
Like most of us in a few months you will be looking at a very slippery slope of modifications and you will be doing archive searches to find out about the PSS-9 suspension

Dont be sceptical... a 964 or a 993 will give you unforgetable thrills and sleepless nights ( from waiting to get back in the car in the morning)

Good luck! <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

 

Hi Pete325,
From your displayed name I assume that you are a BMW fan ? I used to be one, too, until A 964 change that.Now I can't imagine the day when I don't have my 911 to drive. Either one will be a great car, with the 993 being a better all arounder. If you are a hard core, go with the RSA. Remember, either one will give you a whole new meaning to "FUN TO DRIVE!".

 

I have had the opportunity to drive a fairly heavily track modified RS America back-to-back with my stock 993 (with stock suspension) at Buttonwillow. FYI, the RS America had a full cage, slicks, fikse wheels, racing seats n' harnesses, exhaust, some sort of suspension work and probably a bunch more stuff I had no clue about.

Basically, the 964 was much more raw. The biggest thing I noticed was how much steering feedback there was -- I'm not sure if all RS America's lack power steering, but this one did and it really changed the feel of driving the car. I remember asking the driver, while I was a passenger, "do you always play with the steering to test the limits like that?" To which she replied, "what are you talking about?" When I drove it the same thing happened -- so much feedback, following every groove, etc., that my hands were constantly (even somewhat in the straights) playing with the steering wheel ('dancing with the car' as she called it).

Bear in mind that it was a modded car, but it definitely had a higher level of grip, similar power and the brakes seemed just as strong. When I got back in my 993, it seemed much more refined, easier to drive, quieter, and smoother.

Regardless, like all 911s, both are easily induced into trailing throttle oversteer to let you pivot a bit in a turn before getting back on the gas and blasting out toward the track out point.

I didn't push the 964 too hard as it wasn't mine, but I would imagine it would have been a bit more difficult to recover with (due to the increased effort involved to steer the car) and would probably lose grip more dramatically...

 

The RSA makes about 30 HP less but weighs a couple hundred pounds less. It's much more of a track car out of the box and feels lighter and more "raw" as an earlier post pointed out.

The 993 is a better car in nearly every way but has the unfortunate reputation of being the heaviest 911 ever built. That really sucks on the race track. A gutted, race-prepped 993 would be a better race car than a similar 964RSA.

If you want a car that is 80% street car and 20% racer, a 993 is the bette choice. If your intention is to use the car almost exclusively for track days, time trials, or racing, a 964RSA is a great platform that will likely cost you less to make competitive than a 993. Just my thoughts having driven both.

MC

 

I've driven two RSAs, and I own a 993. All RSAs have unassisted steering, which provides amazing feedback (more kickback, too). However, the steering ratio is also considerably slower than the 993 power rack's ratio. Stock 993s understeer less than stock 964s, including RSAs in my opinion, and the early 993 road tests all commented that the 993 turns in more quickly. Each time I drove an RSA, I loved it, but I love my 993 too. Drive them both, pick the one you want -- they're both great cars.

 

I have a 91 964 cab and just recently purchased my 95 993 cab. here are my observations:

1. feel: the 964 is a far more raw ride. you feel the bumps and you feel the rode. the 993 is more refined and feels more like a luxury car.

2. handling: i'm not sure which i prefer. the 993 with it's multi-link suspension will make a lousy driver better. however, i have a much harder time trail braking. also the 993's multi-link comes with a steep price - the rear tires wear out, so that every time you change the oil you change the rear tires with it. on the 993 you definetely feel the extra weight. overall, both cars are lots of fun & hanlde great.

3. power: i'm having a hard time with this one. my 964 has a light weight flywheel & what a difference it makes. the car feels much faster and the butt dyno likes the 964. overall, the 993 has more horsepower but doesn't feel as fast.

Now with that said, I have a beautiful 964 for sale, so if you are in the San Francisco Bay Area, come take a peak at this beauty...

<a href="http://pages.sbcglobal.net/borist/c2.htm" target="_blank">http://pages.sbcglobal.net/borist/c2.htm</a>

This one is setup for autox nicely!

 

Thanks for all your responses and comments. I guess I just have to try out a couple of these to feel the differences myself. And I think it also takes time to get used to the unique feel of the 911 too. Btw, its too bad that they don't sell the 993 RS Carrera in this country