Halcyon

Hi

Read through quite a bit of u guyz's posts, but this is my first time posting

I currently drives a 05' Cayenne v6. As some of you might say that the Cayenne is not an accurate representation of what a real Porsche can do. But as underpowered as it is, I can't say that I dont like it. In fact, it feels quite nice, looks quite nice ( made sure i had the colored bottom trim instead of the not so good looking black plastic trim) . so i fell in love with porsche

anyway, in seek of pure-er porsche-ness
993 coupe is what caught my eyes out of all the models ( including the ones that i couldn't afford xD) it is what i believe to be the porsche-est of all porsche. and as i've seen some of you guys say, in a more dramatic way, 993 IS the last porsche ever made
I'm currently looking around for a ~$18-25k car to drive around maybe 3 or 4 times a week and maybe a trip between SF and LA once every couple months. And most important of all, it gotta be tiptronic. ( yes ...yes... i know... i know i should learn manual... blah blah xD but, LA traffic !!! and SF hills! ) And I've seen several 993 in that range in California. I'm aware that those in that price range are 100k+ miles .

so with that much miles, i learned from you guys that it would NEED a top end rebuilt which cost couple grand right? it is not a matter of IF, but rather, WHEN. so I assume that cost is unavoidable right? unless i find one that is already rebuilt?

and then from reading you guys post, other than the top end rebuilt ( thats the valve thing right?) you guys average $1k on maintenance a year.

assuming i can find one that is relatively clean ( in terms of title/ no crazy repair issues ) but low price just because it has high milege...

lets say i will keep this car for 5 years. lets say i bought it for $25k
$25k + 5k for 5 years of maintenance + a top end rebuilt ( and then of course gas , insurance and stuff which would apply to any car i buy anyway, so thats outta the equation)

on the other hand, my friends are convinced that i should just go with like a more "normal" , lets say 07' merc c300 or something newer. which would cost me also $25k at first to buy, but significantly less maintenance , and no top end rebuilt. but then i'll get owned by the depreciation hit ( which i dont want to go through again after that cayenne xD )

im just guessing, in 5 yrs, a 25k 993 could only get down to 15-17k if its still in pretty decent condition, right? ( or will it just get more classic and appreciate?)
anyway, will that difference in depreciation 25k-> 17k , and 25k -> 12k balance out the cost of maintenance ?
other than the fact that you get 200x more fun and style going around in a classic 13-15yrs old porsche than a merc / bimmer than everyone else got, does it actually cost a lot more to run ?
As far as i see it, that depreciation difference seems to more or less balance out the maintenance cost o.O

Am i looking at this too idealistically? or what? Am i missing something in the equation?
Let me know whatcha guys think? ^__^ i'm here to learn and that is what a forum is for

Howdy993

Just because a car has higher mileage does'nt mean it has to have a top end rebuild. The key is going to be how much oil does it use and does the car pass CA emissions?
The cost of a rebuild is closer to $5K. These cars are not cheap to own unless you do most of your own maintenance / repairs.
Owning a 993 on the cheap won't be good for the car or your wallet.
Don't let the 6 speeders deter you, the tip is a fun car to drive - in manual mode.
Good luck on your search.

Falcondrivr

Mine has 150,000 miles with no rebuild. It still breaks the tires loose in 1st gear straight line acceleration when I hit 3800 RPM.
Any used Merc will cost you thousands in maintenance. By far the highest cost of ownership of any car I'v ever owned out of warranty. (I currently have an '04 ML500. POS!)

Try Cars Dawydiak in SF.

Quadcammer

wow, it breaks the tires loose? who cares. How much oil does it use?


heres the thing:

People here are delusional. They may fix every little rock chip, but they'll pour a quart of oil in every 600 miles and act like nothing is wrong.

Sure, there are some 100k motors that are tight as a drum, use little oil, and have excellent leakdown figures.

$1k a year will most likely be low, especially for the first few years as you make things right.

check strap repairs, fixing any leaks, possible leaking steering rack,, new plugs and wires, etc.

Parts, even with a discount, can be stupid expensive.

Even more important, you will get destroyed on labor if you can't do a lot of stuff yourself.

For instance, lets say a standard 60k mile service:

Plugs and wires: Parts cost about $550, Labor about 3-4 hours so $350
Dizzy caps and rotors: $170 parts, another 1 hour labor so $100

You've exceeded $1k already, and you still haven't addressed fuel filters, air filters, belts, fluids, etc.

I don't care what anybody here says about only needing an oil change once a year, these cars are bloody expensive to fix.

Now, don't listen to falcon, he bought an american built mercedes with a history of bad reliability. The C300 is a relatively simple car, and the 204s have minimal expensive faults. Service is retardedly simple and can be done by anyone with basically no mechanical talent. Parts are expensive, but not porsche expensive, and they are easy to get in a day.

Mercs will kill you on depreciation, but on a lower end model like the C300, if you keep it in good shape, you'll be fine.

the 993 will be about 1000 times more fun than the C300, but your post focused on the financials.

If you buy the 993, you have to have the "its only money" attitude and you have to love it, or your experience will quickly be ruined.

oh, and I can't stress this enough, GET A PPI

Greg964

Why don't you insult a few more people while you're at it?

MrBonus

PecosBill

Obviously you don't not need social skills to be correct.

Quadcammer

You wanna be next?

dcdude

An $18K 993 scares me. If you can stretch your budget to $28K, you could find a pretty nice one, especially since you want a Tip. To me, the trick would be finding one that's enthusiast-owned and well-sorted. I don't have all the data in front of me, but I expect that most of the those are 6 speeds, so you'll need some patience to find a well cared-for Tip.

Also, a '95 is less likely to need a mandatory top end rebuild. The valve guides still wear, but you don't get a Check Engine Light.

If you just want a "nice car" to drive around, the M-B is the clear winner for its practicality. But if you're a sports car enthusiast, the 993 is a slam-dunk, even if your total cost of ownership for the 993 is, say, +$3,000 vs the M-B. If you agree that the costs are similar, the cars are apples and oranges.

shadow993

Drama drama....

It all depends on the car and if you hit the slippery slope. The slippery slope is more expensive than the upkeep.

He is right...if you can do the easy repairs yourself, it will not be that expensive. I bought my car with 28k miles and it needed all the little things to get it right. Plugs, wires, cap, rotors, suspension and filters.

Just get a PPI ....the driving experience is worth the busted nuckles or the $$ for upkeep.

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

While I might not agree with the way Quadcammer delivered the message, its basically true and excellent advice.

These are really good cars so its imperative that you get a PPI by an experienced shop so the overall experience is a good one and you are not ambushed by unforseen repairs.

vincer77

I really do not think that you will see the 993 worth $15k after 5 years. A well maintained car will be worth at least what you paid for it 5 years from know. Look at 964s and SCs - you think a 993 will be worth less? I also think that the merc will cost you the same in maintenance. Now if you did need a top end done, price is more like $6k - $8k. But as mentioned, this is really a call based upon oil consumption that could be asssessed from records of a meticulous (and forthright) PO. There are many high mileage 993s that have not needed top ends.

For $30k, you should be able to find a car (esp a tip) that has had most of the big-ticket maintenance items completed, so you will be left with things like tires and oil changes and maybe some other miscellaneous items. Also, cabs are out of favor and are well priced.

A PPI is a must. Also, don't be a bottom fisher. Look for a well maintaned car with good records. Paying $5k more for a good car is your best insurance.

Linnm

Why all the number crunching? You either want the 993 or you don't

Quadcammer

Firstly, there is no way the merc is as expensive, especially given hat it will be a fairly low mileage 2007.

An A-service is an oil change with a few checks.
A b-service is an oil change, and more checks.

Both can be done at home with minimal skill, minimal tools, and minimal parts cost.

New air filter every 30k, new fuel filter every 50k, cabin filters every 20k, plugs every 100k.

All these parts are inexpensive and readily available. If you should be so unlucky as to have a bunch of electrical malfunctions, yes they can get expensive, but so can every car out there. The 2005+ MBs are on average, very solid cars.

Yes, there are many high mileage cars that haven't had a topend. There are also a lot that have had a top end. There is also a sizeable contingent that NEED top ends but the owners don't want to pay that kinda money, so they'll either ignore it, lie to themselves that it not a problem to add a quart every 600, or they will just "forget" to disclose it upon selling it (hence the ppi).

Finally, even with major things done, stuff breaks, and its not cheap. Its a 15 year old car, stuff happens, its not porsche only. That said, if he needs a new set of tires, his $1k budget is shot right off the bat, and thats not even using PS2s or other fancy rubber. And if he is driving it a bunch, you are looking at a new set of rear tires each year.

Some people like to involve their brain as well as their hear when making a fairly important decision.

I'm sure we'd all love to own 993s, but sometimes you have to consider the financial impact. A bad 993 will eat you out of house and home.

95 NC 993

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