ard

Haven't been on the boards for a while and came to post a question, and found, coincidentally, that other suspension setups have similar issues (https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...-rs-sways.html)

What I have:
* Bilstein HDs (US version - not Gert's version with the extra threads)
* H&R lowering springs
* RS rear sway bar (installed "correctly" - i.e. under the toe links not above them)
* RS drop links
* ride height set a smidgeon above RS ride height

What I CANNOT do:
* set the sway bar to the stiffest setting. Even with the adjustable drop link mount on the Bilsteins set as low as it will go (sandwiched, of course between 2 lockrings), the RS drop links don't seem to be long enough to go to the innermost (i.e. stiffest) holes in the RS swaybars.
* with the car on the ground and the suspension loaded it LOOKS like there might just enough clearance for it to work, but as soon as there is any suspension droop, like when jacking the rear up, the clearance disappears. Apart from making it difficult to perform the adjustment, this lack of clearance is also alarming if the suspension travels through its normal range of motion. It would appear that the toe link would be pressing downward against the drop link if the suspension drooped.

My question
* does anyone have the same suspension setup and if so, have you been able to set the rear swaybar to full stiff?
* have you switched to other drop links? If so, which ones?

TIA

Bill Verburg

You need longer shackles on the rear shock sway bar mounts, there are 2 versions, I posted a comparison pic over on Pelican.

ard

Thank you Bill. Looking at the pictures you PM'd me a while back, it seems that you are using the long TRG shackles. Unfortunately, those don't work with the Bilstein drop link mount.

ard

Quite surprised at the lack of responses.

Is nobody running this suspension setup? I know a few years ago the preferred setup was the PSS-9 setup, but IIRC there were several RL'ers who went the Bilstein HD + HR Springs route. Adding an RS rear sway bar would seem the next logical step.

TIA

Bill Verburg

you can't thread the drop link mounts down any further?
here's an oe 993RS Bilstein using the same mounts I have, Yes TRG long shackle



and a TRG short shackle threaded down low




and 993 Cup Bilstein w/ long shackle

ard

Hi Bill,

thank you for the informative reply and detailed pictures, as always.

To answer your question, no I cannot thread the drop link mount any lower, as it is already at the bottom of the threads.

Now, I am not completely SOL, as I could buy the TRG droplink mounts and longer shackles, but before I proceed down that route which necessitates taking out and reinstalling the rear suspension again (and possibly re-aligning the car), I wanted to find out what other alternatives, namely longer curved droplinks that are much simpler to install, are out there.

MarkD

Alex, how much longer do the drop links need to be?

We (FDM) are working on (for far too long now!) a longer RS style drop link...
We are close to having a finished product but I hesitate to say we will be "done by x-date" since we seem to keep running into one snag or another.
We're down to some basic mounting HW sourcing issues at this point.

ard

Mark, thank you for the reply. I think I need an additional 25 - 40mm in length over the OEM RS droplink but no longer. However, beside the overall length, the curvature plays a role as well. Ideally the curvature would be a little tighter than the OEM RS droplink, otherwise the swaybar would have to be angled downward excessively, with the front ends of the bar then becoming the lowest parts on the underside (something I want to avoid).

It's not like I have to have my swaybar set to the firmest setting - the car is set up and dialed in very well now and I like its handling - it is more a matter of trying out the firmest setting.

Please keep me posted.

MarkD

Hmm... the drop links we are working on are a little longer, however, we could make them any length.

The thing we cannot change is the curve of hte drop link, which is slightly less of a radius than the RS links.
The arc we have does fit in all 3 settings but this is with KWs (fixed mount). The mount position on the HDs will make or break the fit.

ard

Mark,

thanks for the update. It looks like ultimately it will have to be trial and error to see whether your droplink works for my setup. Once you have a finished product, please let me know and we'll decide where to go from there.

Macca

Hi there. Had the same issue on HD (extra thread version) running MO30 springs at 15-20mm above RS spec with RS adjustable bars. My installed had the same issue. What we did is take the standard drop rear drop link from the factory set up, spliced it inserted a steel sheef effectively adding another 20 mm. Total cost for labour was 75 bucks! Worked a treat for 4 years but the bottom of the drop links did sit lower to the pavement although well above ground level and never causes and issue. It did have curvature but as aggressively curved as the RS drop link hence it sat lower - if we had have spliced the RS drop link it would have worked better but i wanted to keep those intact.

I have now changed the set up by loweringteh car to RS spec + 5mm and managed to reinstall the real RS rear drop links. However I now have the same issue as you. They are marginally passable on the middle setting but interfer with the extreme setting (hole). Even now if my car is jacked up the RS drop link ends up sitting against one of the alloy struts and stops the wheel dropping to full effect.

After a few years of playing around with various settings I am of the opinion that the RS drop link although beefy is not a perfect solution with the HD set up. I have no experience with coil overs or PSS9/10.

I would be interested in a longer set of drop links so FisterD and Co - BRING IT ON.

Cheers
M

ard

Macca,

thanks for posting and the picture - my setup and clearances look exactly the same.

I see the following viable options assuming I want to keep most of my current suspension setup.

1. splice an extension into the RS drop link (like you did)
2. add a shackle to the drop link mount (like Bill Verburg did) - this would have to be custom-made since the TRG shackles are not compatible with the Bilstein HD drop link mount
3. go with a larger diameter rollbar, so that the same effective spring rate as with the RS bar on the stiffest setting can be achieved with OEM RS drop links
4. replace the Bilstein HD drop link mount with a TRG one, so that TRG shackles can be used. This is the most elaborate solution since the rear suspension needs to come apart again.

In your setup with the spliced RS drop link did the toe link ever rest on the heim joint at the bottom of the drop link with the suspension at full droop?

TIA

Macca

Hi Alex,

Splicing the drop link is the most cost effective of your four solutions and would elimiate any more expensive labour taking things apart. Its quick, durable, looks acceptable and cheap. I used the thinner standard ROW sway bar drop link - if you used the RS link you would get the right curvature and it would be even stronger till. Im looking at going for a guards LSD next year so will be doing same as I want to beable to firm up the rear swaybar to counter oversteer effect of LSD.

To answer your question with the set up in the picture you see - no the struts never touched the Heim joints - that pucture is full droop albiet without the wheel on the hub. However as I said these didnt have the right curvature - Id say it would just rest on it if you used a similar set up with a RS link and 25mm sleeve. From memory the RS ones are similar when fully jacked.

Cheers
M

Paul902

ard, Macca: have either of you looked into the Tarett adjustable links? We are all at about the same ride height (a touch over RS) and running HDs. I have the M030 RoW sway bars, however. Not sure if the Tarett will work for my combo, or if RS will, or heaven-forbid I need a new anti roll bar!

Macca

Yip. Tarrets wont work as far as I can see with RS adjustable or adjustable TRG bars as they have a different way of sitting than the standard bars (they go under the suspension arms not over). Hence they need to be curved and Tarret do not make a curved ajustable drop link that I know of....

Cheers